Life got very busy, so I don't have as much time online as I used to. But it's nice that this place is still here for those of us wanderers to return to.The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
It has, indeed, Voronwë. Life got very busy, so I don't have as much time online as I used to. But it's nice that this place is still here for those of us wanderers to return to.
Life got very busy, so I don't have as much time online as I used to. But it's nice that this place is still here for those of us wanderers to return to.-
RoseMorninStar
- Posts: 12880
- Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:07 am
- Location: North Shire
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
Heliona, yes, I understand what you mean about the Queen as a person but as a symbol of the country/commonwealth/institution it's probably a bigger deal in the larger sense as the end of an era.
Daughter's trains were cancelled so she went nuts looking for alternative trains, then they were back on. Now she's got 2 sets of tickets, but many of the tours/attractions she has tickets to have closed/canceled (Edinburgh castle, Holyrood house, Buckingham palace, Westminster Abbey, etc.. and since London will probably be packed she's looking for alternative things to do. She can't get a refund on her hotel so they can't just go somewhere else. It's just bad luck/unfortunate timing. She spent so much time planning a certain type of trip and much of it's gone *poof*. It's not the same as say, going to the beach for a laid-back sort of holiday.
Daughter's trains were cancelled so she went nuts looking for alternative trains, then they were back on. Now she's got 2 sets of tickets, but many of the tours/attractions she has tickets to have closed/canceled (Edinburgh castle, Holyrood house, Buckingham palace, Westminster Abbey, etc.. and since London will probably be packed she's looking for alternative things to do. She can't get a refund on her hotel so they can't just go somewhere else. It's just bad luck/unfortunate timing. She spent so much time planning a certain type of trip and much of it's gone *poof*. It's not the same as say, going to the beach for a laid-back sort of holiday.
My heart is forever in the Shire.
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Túrin Turambar
- Posts: 6153
- Joined: Sat Dec 03, 2005 9:37 am
- Location: Melbourne, Victoria
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
The monarchy is a complex and fascinating institution, particularly now, as it tries to find a way forward in a world which no longer accepts the assumptions it was built on.
If you listen to George V’s and Queen Mary’s 1923 Empire Day message to the boys and girls of the British Empire, you can hear something of the mindset in which the late Queen was brought up and which she exemplified in her reign – doing your duty to the Empire (or Commonwealth, as it became), putting others before yourself, and having faith in God’s judgement in putting you in the place he chose for you and in his plans for your future. The idea that “you can be anything you want” is a modern one, coming from the greater prosperity of the post-War world, the relaxed social standards of the counter-culture, and the steady breaking down of formal and informal barriers of class, race, and gender which used to keep people in their respective lanes.
The monarchy, of course, is a direct challenge to that idea. Not so much for the subjects, but for the sovereign herself (or himself). She could never choose, and in a world of choice, that is an odd thing. Her childhood was marred by a great dereliction of duty by the standards of the time, her uncle’s abdication to marry a divorced woman in violation of the teachings of the Church he had sworn to defend. She lived her life guided by the principle that she must never let her people down in the same way. Of course, these days, we’d probably judge Edward VIII far differently – social mores have changed that much.
It is hard to understand today how important the monarchy used to be both in the Commonwealth and outside it. The 1954 Royal Tour of Australia was the biggest single event in the country’s history – literally half the population of Sydney turned out to see the Queen – and in these days of TV and the internet it is unlikely we’d ever see anything like it again. The reaction to the Queen’s death is something of a blend of this latent importance and the modern idea that monarchy is really a bit silly.
Still, as one of the late Queen’s subjects, I really don’t see what more anyone could have asked for her. Her job had become practically impossible by the twenty-first century, but she did it right to the end.
If you listen to George V’s and Queen Mary’s 1923 Empire Day message to the boys and girls of the British Empire, you can hear something of the mindset in which the late Queen was brought up and which she exemplified in her reign – doing your duty to the Empire (or Commonwealth, as it became), putting others before yourself, and having faith in God’s judgement in putting you in the place he chose for you and in his plans for your future. The idea that “you can be anything you want” is a modern one, coming from the greater prosperity of the post-War world, the relaxed social standards of the counter-culture, and the steady breaking down of formal and informal barriers of class, race, and gender which used to keep people in their respective lanes.
The monarchy, of course, is a direct challenge to that idea. Not so much for the subjects, but for the sovereign herself (or himself). She could never choose, and in a world of choice, that is an odd thing. Her childhood was marred by a great dereliction of duty by the standards of the time, her uncle’s abdication to marry a divorced woman in violation of the teachings of the Church he had sworn to defend. She lived her life guided by the principle that she must never let her people down in the same way. Of course, these days, we’d probably judge Edward VIII far differently – social mores have changed that much.
It is hard to understand today how important the monarchy used to be both in the Commonwealth and outside it. The 1954 Royal Tour of Australia was the biggest single event in the country’s history – literally half the population of Sydney turned out to see the Queen – and in these days of TV and the internet it is unlikely we’d ever see anything like it again. The reaction to the Queen’s death is something of a blend of this latent importance and the modern idea that monarchy is really a bit silly.
Still, as one of the late Queen’s subjects, I really don’t see what more anyone could have asked for her. Her job had become practically impossible by the twenty-first century, but she did it right to the end.
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
That is unfortunate. The keys are more likely lost in the post than delayed by the strike.RoseMorninStar wrote: ↑Fri Sep 09, 2022 1:23 pm I'm glad to hear that Aravar. Perhaps she's just having a string of bad luck/poor timing. She's just finishing 3 weeks working on a project in the UK and plans to holiday a in Edinburgh, then London. The keys to her flat rental never arrived (they are blaming it on the mail strike, which didn't make sense to her, they've had 3 weeks!) and she has tickets to travel from Edinburgh to London on a strike day, which are affected unfortunately. Then there are plans to see Buckingham, etc.. and she's wondering if that will be cancelled. She was hoping for a fun, relaxing time after the completion of a stressful project. Of course the Queens passing puts a damper on things as well.
I suspect that the Queen's death will mean that Central London is even busier than usual, but it won't render the various places inaccesible.EDIT to add by that I mean go and look at from the outside.
In London the Tower may still be open, St Paul's was used for service yesterday, and may well be open: it's quite a way away from Westminster where all the ceremonies will take place. The former Naval College at Greenwich is a magnificent building which is worth visiting. There's the various museums in South Kansington (Sceiince, Geology, Natural History and the V & A)
There are also plenty of places outside London which are accessible. Oxford, for example is about an hour by train or coach.
The Queen's death is sad, but she had a good innings.
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
Edit: Have found out this quote is actually from Queen Victoria.
This was so beautiful it nearly moved me to tears. Canada is a Commonwealth country, so the Queen has been our head of state for my entire life so far. I also grew up in the Anglican Church, of which she is also the official head. The day of her death, my church tolled its bell 96 times to mark her passing. (Yes, I've returned to my roots after being with another denomination for a number of years.)
Tonight, I saw this on FB. I'm going to quote it, because the picture that went along with it is kind of large and unwieldy, and the quote fairly short.
The Queen exclaimed, "How I wish the Lord would come in my lifetime!"
"Why?" asked the Chaplin.
The Queen replied with quivering lips and her whole countenance lighted up with deep emotion.
"I should so love to lay my crown at His feet!"
The first hymn in the Anglican Hymn Book for most of my life, has been "Holy, Holy, Holy". One of the verses goes:
Holy, holy, holy! All the saints adore thee,
casting down their golden crowns around the glassy sea
I am wondering if she was thinking of that hymn when she said that. What a beautiful humble sentiment!
This was so beautiful it nearly moved me to tears. Canada is a Commonwealth country, so the Queen has been our head of state for my entire life so far. I also grew up in the Anglican Church, of which she is also the official head. The day of her death, my church tolled its bell 96 times to mark her passing. (Yes, I've returned to my roots after being with another denomination for a number of years.)
Tonight, I saw this on FB. I'm going to quote it, because the picture that went along with it is kind of large and unwieldy, and the quote fairly short.
The Queen exclaimed, "How I wish the Lord would come in my lifetime!"
"Why?" asked the Chaplin.
The Queen replied with quivering lips and her whole countenance lighted up with deep emotion.
"I should so love to lay my crown at His feet!"
The first hymn in the Anglican Hymn Book for most of my life, has been "Holy, Holy, Holy". One of the verses goes:
Holy, holy, holy! All the saints adore thee,
casting down their golden crowns around the glassy sea
I am wondering if she was thinking of that hymn when she said that. What a beautiful humble sentiment!
Last edited by Sunsilver on Tue Sep 20, 2022 8:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
When the night has been too lonely, and the road has been too long,
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
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Túrin Turambar
- Posts: 6153
- Joined: Sat Dec 03, 2005 9:37 am
- Location: Melbourne, Victoria
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
Stephen Fry made the interesting observation that some of the world's freest and most egalitarian countries have a monarch and an established church in violation of all the principles of the Enlightenment - the principles on which the U.S. was founded. I was reminded forcefully of this watching the ceremony proclaiming the new King. The clerk of the Privy Council has informed me that God has selected this man to be my one and only lawful liege lord and I owe him my allegiance. Which isn't much of an inconvenience of my part, and Tolkien's quote about tipping your hat to the squire being damn bad for the squire but damn good for you comes to mind. Still, it's a strange thing to hear in those terms in 2022.
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
I was watching the meeting of the Privy Council and was sttuck by how much of it was pure admn work. Even hje King looked bored,
It's made up of ex officio politicians and others, such as senior judges. That's why, om this occasion, all the living PMs were there. It's a shame it's fodder for the conspiracy theorists.
It's made up of ex officio politicians and others, such as senior judges. That's why, om this occasion, all the living PMs were there. It's a shame it's fodder for the conspiracy theorists.
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
Fodder for the conspiracy theorists... SERIOUSLY??
Wow. Britain has had a monarchy for over 1000 years. And now it's part of a conspiracy??
Get a life, dude!
Edit: I just checked it out. There are multiple conspiracy theories concerning the U.K. royals. The most recent one is that Queen Elizabeth was murdered... https://www.newsweek.com/qanon-queen-el ... cy-1741401
Wow. Britain has had a monarchy for over 1000 years. And now it's part of a conspiracy??
Get a life, dude!
Edit: I just checked it out. There are multiple conspiracy theories concerning the U.K. royals. The most recent one is that Queen Elizabeth was murdered...
https://www.newsweek.com/qanon-queen-el ... cy-1741401
Last edited by Sunsilver on Sat Sep 10, 2022 7:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
When the night has been too lonely, and the road has been too long,
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
My cousin and his wife (who live just north of me in Ontario) are currently in London. Here are a few pics. they posted today from Buckingham Palace.
So, you can see the crowds are not overwhelming. They were able to do normal touristy things, like go up in the Eye of London (the giant Ferris wheel) to sight-see.
So, you can see the crowds are not overwhelming. They were able to do normal touristy things, like go up in the Eye of London (the giant Ferris wheel) to sight-see.
Hidden text.
Hidden text.
Last edited by Sunsilver on Sat Sep 10, 2022 6:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
When the night has been too lonely, and the road has been too long,
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
I live quite close to a large military base. I just got word they have cancelled their annual craft sale, out of respect for Her Majesty. 
Yes, we are still a Commonwealth country, and she was the official head of the Armed Forces...
Yes, we are still a Commonwealth country, and she was the official head of the Armed Forces...
When the night has been too lonely, and the road has been too long,
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
-
RoseMorninStar
- Posts: 12880
- Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:07 am
- Location: North Shire
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
I'm glad your cousin's trip hasn't been impacted Suny.
Unfortunately our daughter's itinerary is pretty much going to follow the funeral schedule (Edinburgh, then London). She had tickets to see Westminster Abbey on the 19th, which- I believe that is the day of the funeral. I've not heard if her tours of Buckingham palace and Holyrood, etc.. have been canceled for certain but her Edinburgh underground tour was canceled. She was able to arrange a tour on a different day for Edinburgh castle, though. Many of the streets in Old Town Edinburgh will be closed while she is there. I would imagine it will be the same in London.
Unfortunately our daughter's itinerary is pretty much going to follow the funeral schedule (Edinburgh, then London). She had tickets to see Westminster Abbey on the 19th, which- I believe that is the day of the funeral. I've not heard if her tours of Buckingham palace and Holyrood, etc.. have been canceled for certain but her Edinburgh underground tour was canceled. She was able to arrange a tour on a different day for Edinburgh castle, though. Many of the streets in Old Town Edinburgh will be closed while she is there. I would imagine it will be the same in London.
My heart is forever in the Shire.
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
Edinburgh Castle is well worth a second look. I spent quite a bit of time there on my two trips to the U.K. My first visit was with the guide of our bus tour, then I returned a second time when we had a free afternoon to explore. SO much history there!
IF she wants some exercise, a hike up to Arthur's Seat is worth it for the view.
IF she wants some exercise, a hike up to Arthur's Seat is worth it for the view.
When the night has been too lonely, and the road has been too long,
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
-
RoseMorninStar
- Posts: 12880
- Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:07 am
- Location: North Shire
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
We were very fortunate (and very thankful) for much help from Jude on what to do and see in Edinburgh. He was so very helpful and she had the perfect Edinburgh highlight tour planned. But even best laid plans can have a wrench thrown in the mix and that is what has happened. She and I have seen Edinburgh castle before, but her significant other has not. The last time we were there (on a tour) we were unable to see the underground of Edinburgh and that appears as if it will be closed while she is there, as are many other sites, probably for security reasons. It appears Old town, Holyrood, Carlton hill/St. Antony ruins/Arthurs seat, and parts of the Royal Mile will be closed for part of the time. They will have to play it by ear. Then, as she heads to London, so will the Queen, throwing a wrench into those plans as well. As the Japanese would say, "Shō ga nai" .. 'It can't be helped'.
My heart is forever in the Shire.
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
Such a beautiful tribute, by the daughter of the late Canadian jazz pianist, Oscar Peterson!
Oscar Peterson
"Behind every figure is a human being. That is what is at the forefront of my mind as the entire world processes the loss of one of the most formidable figures in our history.
This day - this moment - has always meant a great deal to me. I remember how much joy and pride dad held as someone who had been asked to perform for Her Majesty and Prince Phillip, who were in Toronto in 2002 as part of the tour commemorating her Golden Jubilee. The evening at Roy Thomson Hall was a gathering of some of Canada's spectacular artists and performers, which culminated in a performance of Hymn To Freedom.
Dad had been invited to be in the presence of Her Majesty and members of the Royal Family on previous occasions, but this event was particularly special for him. In the days leading up to the concert, he spent a lot of time talking to then 12 year-old Céline about some of Queen Elizabeth's history. He touched on the things that he was fascinated by, including her love of art and music. He talked about why he held a great deal of respect for her as a leader and as a human being. Coming from someone who had traveled extensively, meeting people from every part of the world, and who held his own experiences as a man belonging to a visible [black] minority and how he would get treated differently depending on where he was and who he was with, these views always carried a lot of weight for me. His outlook reminded me then and reminds me now how important it is to look at life and the people in it and show grace, kindness, understanding and compassion.
While getting ready to head to the stage from the dressing room, I saw my dad putting his jacket with all his medals on. A sight I had not previously ever seen before. When I looked in his eyes, I could see the emotion, nerves, and most predominantly, the pride of his doing this at 77 years old. He was proud of his accomplishments. He was proud to represent his country. He was taking in a once in a lifetime moment the way he deserved to, which was with joy.
At the end of the evening as I walked behind the incredible artists who had just all given their all to share their art with Her Majesty and Prince Phillip, and made my way to stand beside my dad at his request and meet Queen Elizabeth, I caught the eye first of Uncle Niels-Henning Ørsted Pedersen, whose smile and wink showed me the same pride that dad had. When I made my way next to dad, I said "you did it" and he responded with tears, a very tight hug, and "are you ready to stand beside dad and meet the Queen?"
Throughout her historic 70-year reign, Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II built an untouchable legacy. It is with endless respect that I say the only thing I feel is appropriate: Thank you, your Majesty. May you rest peacefully."
Céline Peterson
When the night has been too lonely, and the road has been too long,
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
Rose, it might help her to reframe this as a huge cultural opportunity. She's in the UK as the monarchy changes over. The new King is an old man himself so this will probably happen again within her lifetime but she gets to be there for this one. Think less on what's closed down and more on why it's closed down.
When you can do nothing what can you do?
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
Why in heaven's name would Arthur's seat be closed down?? It's part of a very large park, for pete's sake!! 
When the night has been too lonely, and the road has been too long,
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
There is a royal procession scheduled for Monday 12 September as the coffin will be transported from Holyrood to St. Giles. There will then be a vigil at St. Giles. If I were in town, I would rearrange my schedule to be a part of that and to pay my last respects.
Where did you hear that Holyrood Park and the ruins of St. Anthony's Chapel would be closed? That doesn't sound feasible - it's a wide open huge outdoor space.
Your daughter is lucky, in a way - she gets a chance to witness a bit of history.
Where did you hear that Holyrood Park and the ruins of St. Anthony's Chapel would be closed? That doesn't sound feasible - it's a wide open huge outdoor space.
Your daughter is lucky, in a way - she gets a chance to witness a bit of history.
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
Website for Holyrood Park. Looks like there's something up with one of the footpaths and they're restricting vehicles on weekends but the park is still open.
When you can do nothing what can you do?
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
I see that it says that the Radical Road footpath is closed. That's due to unsafe conditions and erosion, and it was also closed when I was there in the spring. It didn't stop me from having a good hike, though.
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RoseMorninStar
- Posts: 12880
- Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:07 am
- Location: North Shire
Re: The Passing of Queen Elizabeth II
Oh, I'm sure she's trying to do that because she has no other choice, but if any one of us had spent thousands of dollars for a romantic trip for your engagement and plans canceled/changed for not one or 2 days but NINE out of 11 days -no less to be overshadowed by a funeral- I'm sure most of us would be pretty bummed. It's not just the cost, but the time off work. Who knows when they can afford the (time or money) to go again. So, I'm sure she'll try to make the best of it but to pretend it isn't a disappointment isn't realistic.River wrote: ↑Sat Sep 10, 2022 9:11 pm Rose, it might help her to reframe this as a huge cultural opportunity. She's in the UK as the monarchy changes over. The new King is an old man himself so this will probably happen again within her lifetime but she gets to be there for this one. Think less on what's closed down and more on why it's closed down.
She sent me a message listing some of the cancellations/closings. I'll have to look through it. They are limiting traffic and many of the things she going to do were part of a day tour. There are things one wouldn't think would be canceled, yet they are. Or perhaps she just feels overwhelmed. Understandably.
My heart is forever in the Shire.