2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
- RoseMorninStar
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
Yes.
I think it often comes down to a 'any ends justifies the means' vs. a 'do we do the same to evenly compete and become that which we deplore'.
I think it often comes down to a 'any ends justifies the means' vs. a 'do we do the same to evenly compete and become that which we deplore'.
My heart is forever in the Shire.
- elengil
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
Me and Sweetie have been having this very conversation in a variety of ways for quite a while now, and it gets more depressing every timeVoronwë the Faithful wrote: ↑Thu May 12, 2022 8:53 pm Forgive my moment of extreme cynicism, but not only is democracy already dead (if it ever was really alive), the human race itself is already in its death throes as we have passed the point of actually being able to take the actions necessary to effectively address the climate crisis.
The dumbest thing I've ever bought
was a 2020 planner.
"Does anyone ever think about Denethor, the guy driven to madness by staying up late into the night alone in the dark staring at a flickering device he believed revealed unvarnished truth about the outside word, but which in fact showed mostly manipulated media created by a hostile power committed to portraying nothing but bad news framed in the worst possible way in order to sap hope, courage, and the will to go on? Seems like he's someone we should think about." - Dave_LF
was a 2020 planner.
"Does anyone ever think about Denethor, the guy driven to madness by staying up late into the night alone in the dark staring at a flickering device he believed revealed unvarnished truth about the outside word, but which in fact showed mostly manipulated media created by a hostile power committed to portraying nothing but bad news framed in the worst possible way in order to sap hope, courage, and the will to go on? Seems like he's someone we should think about." - Dave_LF
- Voronwë the Faithful
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
This is an interesting piece along those lines.N.E. Brigand wrote: ↑Wed May 18, 2022 7:37 am One hopes that it was a move long planned and that it will bear fruit.
‘Pretty savvy’ DOJ just sidestepped legal battles that have slowed Jan. 6 committee’s probe: legal expert
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
Here's a letter that the January 6th Committee today sent to Representative Barry Loudermilk, Republican of Georgia, asking him to meet with them to discuss a tour that he led on January 5, 2021.
As the letter notes, Republicans on the Committee on House Administration -- which includes Laudermilk -- had previously put out a statement saying they had reviewed security footage from January 5 and determined that no members had led a tour that day.
The concern, of course, is that the January 6th insurrectionists may have been able to conduct reconnaissance before the attack, and may have had help from members of Congress. And whether or not that happened, it appears that some members have tried to cover up evidence, so if the tour was innocuous, to me the Republican statement appears to flirt with obstruction.
As the letter notes, Republicans on the Committee on House Administration -- which includes Laudermilk -- had previously put out a statement saying they had reviewed security footage from January 5 and determined that no members had led a tour that day.
The concern, of course, is that the January 6th insurrectionists may have been able to conduct reconnaissance before the attack, and may have had help from members of Congress. And whether or not that happened, it appears that some members have tried to cover up evidence, so if the tour was innocuous, to me the Republican statement appears to flirt with obstruction.
- Voronwë the Faithful
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
Just coming here to post about that, but ya beat me to it. Loudermilk, of course, will refuse to meet with the committee and then they'll have to decide whether to issue a subpoena for him to ignore.
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
- Voronwë the Faithful
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
Shouldn't have poked the bear, Donald.
Former Attorney General William Barr tentatively agrees to give sworn
In the old days I would have considered this extremely significant. Now, who nows?
Former Attorney General William Barr tentatively agrees to give sworn
In the old days I would have considered this extremely significant. Now, who nows?
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
You got the Barr scoop, though!Voronwë the Faithful wrote: ↑Thu May 19, 2022 8:52 pm Just coming here to post about that, but ya beat me to it. Loudermilk, of course, will refuse to meet with the committee and then they'll have to decide whether to issue a subpoena for him to ignore.
As for Loudermilk, he now admits to having led a tour that day. He says it was just a family from his district. Maybe it was! But why didn't he just admit that before?
And in other 2020 election news, NBC has an interview with Michigan's secretary of state, Jocelyn Benson, in which she says she has been told that in a post-election meeting in the White House, President Donald Trump said that she should be arrested for treason and executed. In response, Donald Trump's spokesperson said, "I have it on good authority that Secretary Benson knowingly lied throughout her interview with NBC News," which might or might not be a denial of Benson's claim.
- RoseMorninStar
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
All of the people at the Jan. 6 insurrection came from somewhere, even those who were violent. 'Just' a family from his district could be meaningless, or not. Cleveland Meredith, Jr, one of the most violent insurrectionists, was from Georgia, just one district over from Loudermilk's district.N.E. Brigand wrote: ↑Fri May 20, 2022 1:12 am
As for Loudermilk, he now admits to having led a tour that day. He says it was just a family from his district. Maybe it was! But why didn't he just admit that before?
My heart is forever in the Shire.
- Voronwë the Faithful
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
Right-wing attorney who challenged election results says Trump wrote him handwritten notes
This is a somewhat misleading headline, comma since it is clear that trump did give gives Eastman handwritten notes as the judge is already reviewing them. I think it is likely that judge Carter will rule that these documents also need to be turned over to the committee. We'llsee.
This is a somewhat misleading headline, comma since it is clear that trump did give gives Eastman handwritten notes as the judge is already reviewing them. I think it is likely that judge Carter will rule that these documents also need to be turned over to the committee. We'llsee.
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
- Voronwë the Faithful
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
First on CNN: Giuliani meets with January 6 committee for more than 9 hours
That's a lonnnnngggg deposition.
That's a lonnnnngggg deposition.
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
N.E. Brigand wrote: ↑Thu May 19, 2022 8:47 pm Here's a letter that the January 6th Committee today sent to Representative Barry Loudermilk, Republican of Georgia, asking him to meet with them to discuss a tour that he led on January 5, 2021.
As the letter notes, Republicans on the Committee on House Administration -- which includes Laudermilk -- had previously put out a statement saying they had reviewed security footage from January 5 and determined that no members had led a tour that day.
The concern, of course, is that the January 6th insurrectionists may have been able to conduct reconnaissance before the attack, and may have had help from members of Congress. And whether or not that happened, it appears that some members have tried to cover up evidence, so if the tour was innocuous, to me the Republican statement appears to flirt with obstruction.
Loudermilk has since updated his explanation. After this news broke on Thursday, he referred to the visitors as "a constituent family with young children meeting with their Member of Congress".RoseMorninStar wrote: ↑Fri May 20, 2022 2:01 amAll of the people at the Jan. 6 insurrection came from somewhere, even those who were violent. 'Just' a family from his district could be meaningless, or not. Cleveland Meredith, Jr, one of the most violent insurrectionists, was from Georgia, just one district over from Loudermilk's district.N.E. Brigand wrote: ↑Fri May 20, 2022 1:12 am
As for Loudermilk, he now admits to having led a tour that day. He says it was just a family from his district. Maybe it was! But why didn't he just admit that before?
Yesterday he put out a video describing them he "took a family with young children and their guests to lunch in a cafeteria in one of the house office buildings" (emphasis added).
Still could be true. Still odd that he never thought to clear this up before.
- RoseMorninStar
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
Yes. And you would think there would be security video? I'm trying to recall how that worked when we toured the capitol (we were on a general admission tour, not a special tour by a congressperson). I think we had to show ID/register and I'm sure there were security cameras on during at least part of our visit.N.E. Brigand wrote: ↑Sat May 21, 2022 7:12 pm
Still could be true. Still odd that he never thought to clear this up before.
My heart is forever in the Shire.
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
Per stories in the Orlando Sentinel and Tampa Bay Times, three more people have been charged in this scheme, in which individuals were paid to be phony candidates in an effort to dilute the vote and help Republicans win.N.E. Brigand wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 1:45 amAn update on this story from the Orlando Sentinel, headlined: Florida Power & Light Execs Worked Closely With Consultants Behind 'Ghost' Candidate Scheme, Records Reveal.Voronwë the Faithful wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:56 amUnder the circumstances described in that article? It certainly seems fraudulent, but I simply am not knowledgeable enough to say for sure.N.E. Brigand wrote:Is it a crime to pay someone to run as a third-party candidate in order to split the vote of the opposition? Asking for a friend.
"These records reveal that start-up expenses for Grow United, the dark-money nonprofit central to the spoiler candidate scandal, were billed to Florida Power & Light by operatives then working for Matrix LLC, an Alabama consulting firm."
This is a flyer for one of those ghost candidates:
This is an actual picture of the candidate:
I guess the woman in the first photo is supposed to be a constituent calling the candidate, not the candidate herself.
- RoseMorninStar
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
Like Kanye West trying to get on the Wisconsin ballot?
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
Gun rights proponents are fond of saying that the only thing that will stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun.
I'm seeing reports that the gunman in Texas today who killed 21 people, including 19 young children, shot his way past police to get into the school.
I'm seeing reports that the gunman in Texas today who killed 21 people, including 19 young children, shot his way past police to get into the school.
Last edited by N.E. Brigand on Wed May 25, 2022 6:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
- RoseMorninStar
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
When just about anyone can arm themselves with not just a gun, but a weapon of war along with all of the protective gear afforded a soldier of war, gear that our average police officer doesn't have, we the people.. and our children.. have little defense.
I've heard the army has commissioned a new rifle, one that can shoot through body armor. The gun makers have decided to make this weapon of war available to Joe Q Public. It will make the AR15 look like a toy.
I've heard the army has commissioned a new rifle, one that can shoot through body armor. The gun makers have decided to make this weapon of war available to Joe Q Public. It will make the AR15 look like a toy.
My heart is forever in the Shire.
- Voronwë the Faithful
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
As hard as it is to believe, that is apparently exactly what happened. And yet it won't remotely stop the "the answer is a good guys with a gun" narrative.N.E. Brigand wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 6:33 am I'm seeing reports that the gunman in Texas today who killed 21 people, including 19 young children, shot his way past police to get into the school.
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
- Voronwë the Faithful
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
It is worth noting that while he is not under investigation in this case (though he is still under investigation for sexual misconduct), the candidate that the ghost candidate was designed to benefit is a close associate of Rep. Matt Gaetz as well as Joel Greenberg, the former tax collector who has been charged in the sexual misconduct case and is cooperating in the investigation of Gaetz.N.E. Brigand wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 10:30 pmPer stories in the Orlando Sentinel and Tampa Bay Times, three more people have been charged in this scheme, in which individuals were paid to be phony candidates in an effort to dilute the vote and help Republicans win.N.E. Brigand wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 1:45 amAn update on this story from the Orlando Sentinel, headlined: Florida Power & Light Execs Worked Closely With Consultants Behind 'Ghost' Candidate Scheme, Records Reveal.Voronwë the Faithful wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:56 am
Under the circumstances described in that article? It certainly seems fraudulent, but I simply am not knowledgeable enough to say for sure.
"These records reveal that start-up expenses for Grow United, the dark-money nonprofit central to the spoiler candidate scandal, were billed to Florida Power & Light by operatives then working for Matrix LLC, an Alabama consulting firm."
Charges Filed In Gaetz-Linked Florida Ghost Candidate Scheme
Meanwhile in Michigan, the staff of the Bureau of Elections has recommended that five of the GOP candidates for governor be removed from the ballot because of fraudulent petition signature gathering practices (though it is not alleged that the campaigns themselves conducted the fraudulent practices.
Fraudulent petition signatures turn Michigan's GOP race for governor on its head
The Bureau of Elections is supposedly going to make a decision tomorrow about whether to follow the recommendation. There is also a significant likelihood that criminal charges will be filed against those responsible for the fraud.LANSING – For a group of candidates who campaigned on election integrity and in some cases promoted unfounded claims of fraud related to the 2020 election, Monday's reports from the Bureau of Elections impacting the GOP race for governor might be comical, were they not so damning.
Citing a level of signature fraud unprecedented in its volume and scope, bureau staff have recommended that five of the 10 Republican candidates who filed petitions to get their names on the Aug. 2 primary election ballot for governor be disqualified.
Out of the race would be former Detroit Police Chief James Craig, Oakland County businessman and "quality guru" Perry Johnson, Byron Center businesswoman Donna Brandenburg, Grand Haven financial adviser Michael Markey and Michigan State Police Capt. Mike Brown of Stevensville, who already announced Tuesday he is ending his campaign.
One begins to understand why Republicans are so worried about election fraud; they do seem to conduct quite a bit of it!
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
Maggie Haberman of the New York Times writes: "The Jan 6 committee has testimony that [former White House Chief of Staff Mark] Meadows told colleagues [that President Donald] Trump said something to the effect of maybe [Vice President Mike] Pence should be hung".
Edited to add text from the Times article:
Shortly after hundreds of rioters at the Capitol started chanting “Hang Mike Pence!” on Jan. 6, 2021, the White House chief of staff, Mark Meadows, left the dining room off the Oval Office, walked into his own office and told colleagues that President Donald J. Trump was complaining that the vice president was being whisked to safety.
Mr. Meadows, according to an account provided to the House committee investigating Jan. 6, then told the colleagues that Mr. Trump had said something to the effect of, maybe Mr. Pence should be hung.
It is not clear what tone Mr. Trump was said to have used. But the reported remark was further evidence of how extreme the rupture between the president and his vice president had become, and of how Mr. Trump not only failed to take action to call off the rioters but appeared to identify with their sentiments about Mr. Pence — whom he had unsuccessfully pressured to block certification of the Electoral College results that day — as a reflection of his own frustration at being unable to reverse his loss.
- RoseMorninStar
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Re: 2020 Election: Predictions, Results and Reactions
Just. ... Ugh.
May as well have been a Roman Coliseum. Trump wanted blood sport.
May as well have been a Roman Coliseum. Trump wanted blood sport.
My heart is forever in the Shire.