Lord of the Rings series!?

For discussion of Amazon's new television show "The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power"
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Stranger Wings
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

Post by Stranger Wings »

I would love to see such Silvan royalty, yeah. Perhaps they'll enter into Arondir's story at some point?
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

It's hard to see how that will not be the case, particularly since supposedly the series will extend into the Last Alliance. But time will tell.
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

Post by RoseMorninStar »

I was wondering about the potential difficulties of producing a series where one people is very, very long lived and the other is, by comparison, gone in the blink of an eye. I would think it would be a balancing act without having to introduce too many characters/without it being confusing.
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

New poster, apparently. What's the white stuff?
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

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Voronwë the Faithful wrote: Mon Aug 08, 2022 7:02 pm New poster, apparently. What's the white stuff?
They look like the white petals of Nimloth.
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

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Stranger Wings wrote: Mon Aug 08, 2022 2:11 pmI would love to see such Silvan royalty, yeah. Perhaps they'll enter into Arondir's story at some point?
I'm really curious to see exactly what the Elvish political structure of ROP's Middle-earth looks like. Arondir is called a Silvan Elf, yet formerly lived in Beleriand, which makes me think he's one of the Nandor who made it as far as Ossiriand. And he's apparently a guard making sure the descendants of the First Age Easterlings don't leave the land they were exiled to, which would seem to be an Eldarin military project. Maybe he once served one of the Sons of Fëanor, who ruled much of Ossiriand and mingled with the Nandor/Laiquendi? If so, I wouldn't necessarily expect him to have much to do with the Silvan Elves of Lórinand (later Lórien) or Eryn Galen (later Mirkwood), who either never made it to Beleriand at all, or were Sindarin refugees from Doriath who had more reason than most to hate Fëanorians. Plus, Arondir is in the "Southlands," which I still think probably means Gondor, though I was intrigued by the recent suggestion on TORn that it might be pre-ruination Mordor.

(It's probably not worth noting this, given we already know ROP is using stuff that only appears in posthumously published material, but if they were truly limited only to LOTR, then Oropher shouldn't appear in the series. He's not mentioned in LOTR at all, and Appendix B credits the founding of the Elvish realm in "Greenwood the Great" to Thranduil.)
RoseMorninStar wrote: Mon Aug 08, 2022 5:04 pmI was wondering about the potential difficulties of producing a series where one people is very, very long lived and the other is, by comparison, gone in the blink of an eye. I would think it would be a balancing act without having to introduce too many characters/without it being confusing.
The showrunners have talked about this a little bit, and it's one of their main arguments for extreme timeline compression. Basically, make it so events unfold rapidly enough that the human characters can live through them all, despite their comparatively short lifespans.
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

Another poster. Thoughts?
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

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Perhaps a memorial to Finrod?
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

Maybe. That raises the question of whether they will address Gil-galad's genealogy. Will they go with the "ephemeral ideal" of Gil-galad as Fingon's son, as adopted in the published Silmarillion, or the later idea of Gil-galad as Finrod's nephew (or great-nephew)?
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

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I'm biased here, in that I vastly prefer the idea of Gil-galad as an Arafinwean, but I liked the speculation on the main blog of TORn (I think written by Demosthenes) that the eight-pointed star motif was an emblem of the House of Finarfin,* which would account for both Galadriel and Gil-galad wearing it.


*For as little sense as that makes to me, as a reader of Silmarillion fanfiction, where the Star of Fëanor is typically described as eight-pointed. :P I've met some people on forums who insist it has sixteen points, but I'm more inclined to describe the version on the Doors of Durin as having eight points and eight rays. In any event, it's definitely distinct from the design we've seen in ROP.
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

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Out of curiosity, why do you "vastly prefer the idea of Gil-galad as an Arafinwean?"
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

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Primarily because the High Kingship of the Noldor passing to Fingon's brother before his son bugged me from the very first time I read it, since there is otherwise no indication that the Noldor, or any other Eldarin or Edainic monarchy, practiced agnatic seniority. (I do not consider Fingolfin claiming the throne to be a counter-example.) However, if Gil-galad is descended from Finarfin, this problem (if one considers it a problem) disappears. Also, I find the characterization of Finwë's descendants in "The Shibboleth of Fëanor" more interesting than the 1977 Silmarillion's depiction(s), mostly because it's more detailed, so I'm inclined to favor it in matters of inconsistency. :P
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

For the record, I completely concur, and always had the same reaction.
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

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Voronwë the Faithful wrote: Tue Aug 09, 2022 10:00 pmFor the record, I completely concur, and always had the same reaction.
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

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Hate to spoil the party, but I was always intrigued by that inconsistency. Why was agnatic seniority practiced in this instance, thus robbing Gil-galad of his rightful title? And did this humbling event perhaps make him a better king later in life? It raised questions that I was curious to have answers for. And then I realized there was no answer, and I thought: there's a good subject for a TV show. JD and Patrick, I hope you're listening.
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

Eldy wrote: Tue Aug 09, 2022 8:40 pm Perhaps a memorial to Finrod?
Not just Finrod!
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

Post by Stranger Wings »

Voronwë the Faithful wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 2:03 am
Eldy wrote: Tue Aug 09, 2022 8:40 pm Perhaps a memorial to Finrod?
Not just Finrod!
It’s beautiful! Has anyone on the interwebs complained yet about it not looking Tolkien?
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

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It *is* beautiful.
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

Stranger Wings wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 8:52 am
Voronwë the Faithful wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 2:03 am
Eldy wrote: Tue Aug 09, 2022 8:40 pm Perhaps a memorial to Finrod?
Not just Finrod!
It’s beautiful! Has anyone on the interwebs complained yet about it not looking Tolkien?
You mean this specific picture, which I took from a post on Facebook? The only negative comment was someone saying "Yea. But the looks of elves in this series is nt ok." I'm not actually sure where this picture is from. I've asked, but does anyone recall seeing anything like it before?

More generally, plenty of people have complained about how much it doesn't look or sound like Tolkien. Just the other day, David Bratman wrote in a comment to a blog post by John Rateliff: "Yes. While the trailer scenery looks great, the dialog sounds like the kind of fantasy I turned to Tolkien to get away from. If I get bored and turn the show off after one episode, that'll show that evaluation was right."
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Re: Lord of the Rings series!?

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