Your one main concern? The possible dealbreaker?

[Dave_LF]

There are indications that Kili's non-dwarvishness is deliberate, and that he will even be teased by the other dwarves for looking like an elf. That would help.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

Are there indications of that? Or are you speculating about it?

[Dave_LF]

I thought Turner said a couple things to the effect in one of the vlogs. I wasn't sure if he was joking or not.

[Impenitent]

If so, that would be an interesting (totally non-canon) twist.

[Frelga]

There is absolutely nothing canon about PJ's dwarves. Tolkien's dwarves turned up with musical instruments and no weapons, no wilderness skills, and the only reason they didn't get lost in a paper bag is because such things were unknown in Middle-earth. It is their incompetence that forces Bilbo to become the real leader of the group.

I'm a bit surprised that the change from a band of misfits to PJ's fearsome crew does not irk people more than the length of beards.

[axordil]

There is absolutely nothing canon about PJ's dwarves. Tolkien's dwarves turned up with musical instruments and no weapons, no wilderness skills, and the only reason they didn't get lost in a paper bag is because such things were unknown in Middle-earth. It is their incompetence that forces Bilbo to become the real leader of the group.

I'm a bit surprised that the change from a band of misfits to PJ's fearsome crew does not irk people more than the length of beards.

Well, most of that was for comic purposes. I always thought it strange that Thorin's company was so incompetent at the start and such fearsome warriors in the BOFA, such that a dozen of them rushing out made a difference in the battle.

ETA: And Thorin, at least, was supposed to be bad-ass, from his backstory.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

I thought Turner said a couple things to the effect in one of the vlogs. I wasn't sure if he was joking or not.

I don't recall him saying anything like that. I recall people speculating about it. But perhaps I am wrong.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

There is absolutely nothing canon about PJ's dwarves. Tolkien's dwarves turned up with musical instruments and no weapons, no wilderness skills, and the only reason they didn't get lost in a paper bag is because such things were unknown in Middle-earth. It is their incompetence that forces Bilbo to become the real leader of the group.

I'm a bit surprised that the change from a band of misfits to PJ's fearsome crew does not irk people more than the length of beards.

PJ's fearsome crew, as you put it, is consistent with the overall portrait that Tolkien paints of the Dwarves, if one looks beyond just the text of The Hobbit. Since PJ is not just adapting the text of The Hobbit it makes sense that his dwarves would be consistent with that overall portrait.

[narya]

I'm such a slobbering fan girl for the movies and the books that I can't think of a deal breaker. I see the Hobbit movies as an expansion and enrichment of the legendarium Tolkien gave us. I don't want to be constricted in my personal fantasies about Middle Earth and don't expect others to have the exact same fantasies as I have, including PJ. I suppose that means I'm not a purist.

[Dave_LF]

I thought Turner said a couple things to the effect in one of the vlogs. I wasn't sure if he was joking or not.

I don't recall him saying anything like that. I recall people speculating about it. But perhaps I am wrong.

It was in one of the early vlogs; the one that focused one the dwarves. Some of the other actors were teasing him for being a pretty boy and looking like an elf, and it seemed like they were at least half in character when they did it. I'll look for it later tonight if no one beats me to it. Naturally, it could have just been a joke that meant nothing.

[Frelga]

Well, most of that was for comic purposes. I always thought it strange that Thorin's company was so incompetent at the start and such fearsome warriors in the BOFA, such that a dozen of them rushing out made a difference in the battle.

ETA: And Thorin, at least, was supposed to be bad-ass, from his backstory.

Yeah, I wondered about that, too. They get ambushed and overcome by everyone and their grandma, and suddenly they discover their inner ninja?

Thorin IS a badass, but even he doesn't carry a weapon until they find the trolls cache.

But the point is, book dwarves need Bilbo, he ends up taking care of them. That's the major driver of his growth. These guys... I wonder.

I do think people underestimate The Hobbit as a book. For some readers "lighthearted" seems to exclude "deep". T

[River]

It's been a while since I read the book, but I'm wondering if it wasn't so much skills the dwarves needed as effective leadership.

[axordil]

And maybe a compass.

[Holbytla]

There will be no overall deal breaker for me, and based on past history, lots of "woah" and "ugh" moments.

I think Jackson and company have done a commendable job with Tolkien's works, but there are too many instances where they either don't seem to get what Tolkien was trying to say, or opted for what they felt was a better course. I wish they had more faith in Tolkien's storytelling abilities, and focused less on "adaptation" and "flash bang" aspects of the story.

Knowing what I know and believing what I believe, I'm fearful of the movie makers missing out on the simple charm that is the Hobbit. I believe we are going to get a prequel to LOTR, which for good or bad, was written in a different style. The writing and story evolved over the course of time, to a darker more serious place, but the point of inception was more lighthearted and carefree tone.

I think the way the Harry Potter series evolved over the telling of the story was a positive aspect of the series. I'm fearful we are going to miss that evolution and the growth of Bilbo from frightened "burrahobbit" to "wise Arkenstone barterer".

I can swallow hard and live (barely) with PJ's over-indulgence, but I will be most disappointed if we lose out on the story's and Bilbo's transformation for the sake of more box office receipts and a series of prequel movies.

[yovargas]

In a very different vein, I'm legitimately worried about the whole 48 FPS thing. I've seen this look on some hi-def blu-ray type stuff and no matter how much I tell myself "it's just cuz you're not used to it!' I can' t help but think it looks cheap and anti-immersive. They're taking a really big risk pouring this much money into a technology they're not sure people will actually want.

[kzer_za]

I am a little worried about Smaug actually - has there ever been a good movie dragon, at least non-animated? And since he's pretty much the definitive fantasy dragon, people are going to expect a lot from him. But Weta will probably rise to the challenge.

[Lalaith]

I'm such a slobbering fan girl for the movies and the books that I can't think of a deal breaker. I see the Hobbit movies as an expansion and enrichment of the legendarium Tolkien gave us. I don't want to be constricted in my personal fantasies about Middle Earth and don't expect others to have the exact same fantasies as I have, including PJ. I suppose that means I'm not a purist.

IAWN!

[Frelga]

Kser_za, I can't think of a good movie dragon either, but I expect Smaug will be good.

PJ's fearsome crew, as you put it, is consistent with the overall portrait that Tolkien paints of the Dwarves, if one looks beyond just the text of The Hobbit. Since PJ is not just adapting the text of The Hobbit it makes sense that his dwarves would be consistent with that overall portrait.

PJ's dwarves are more true to Tolkien than Tolkien's dwarves?

[halplm]

Kser_za, I can't think of a good movie dragon either, but I expect Smaug will be good.

PJ's fearsome crew, as you put it, is consistent with the overall portrait that Tolkien paints of the Dwarves, if one looks beyond just the text of The Hobbit. Since PJ is not just adapting the text of The Hobbit it makes sense that his dwarves would be consistent with that overall portrait.

PJ's dwarves are more true to Tolkien than Tolkien's dwarves?

Yeah, I had the same reaction to VtF's comment, but didn't quite know how to say it .

My favorite movie dragon was in Dragonheart, but I'm sure they can do better.

The filming in 48fps is quite possibly the best thing PJ has ever done. It is a very important step in film history and my only worry is the movies will be so bad people will not want to do it in the future.

As for the basic question of the thread, there are so many it's hard to start .

But, ultimately the deal breaker for me will be the inevitable loss of feeling like a "fairy-story." I spoke about this at length discussing LOTR some years ago, but one of the techniques Tolkien uses in LOTR to center the story on the hobbits is their expanding knowledge of the world and how big it is.

This is set up by The Hobbit and is one of the more wonderful ways that LOTR works as a sequel.

From it's beginning in a comfortable hobbit-hole, to being whisked away astonishingly on an "adventure," The Hobbit promotes a first look into a world very different from our own, but magical and mysterious. With a wizard that appears and disappears at odd times, to a mountain pass filled with terrifying giants and storms... it never loses the feeling of other-worldliness... a fairy-story at its core. Gollum, Beorn, Mirkwood, Elves, dragons, and a mysterious legendary jewel. Bilbo is constantly in awe and wonder at the world he (like we) didn't even know existed.

We know with a certainty that this will not be the case with PJs Hobbit. With the expansion into three films especially it's impossible. We won't be trying to figure out this mysterious Gandalf figure who disappears and reappears with uncanny timing... we'll see where he goes. The tone will be that of LOTR, which is a gritty big world in action tone. We won't be seeing through Bilbo's eyes, but through PJs.

That's a deal breaker.

[yovargas]

The filming in 48fps is quite possibly the best thing PJ has ever done. It is a very important step in film history and my only worry is the movies will be so bad people will not want to do it in the future.

Do you have reason to believe the general public's reaction to the final product won't be pretty much the same reaction as those first people who saw 48fps footage?