The Middle-earth 1200

An exhaustive compilation of the characters of Tolkien's legendarium, in order of importance, by Dân o Nandor on Anduin
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Dân o Nandor on Anduin
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#s 1100-1091

Post by Dân o Nandor on Anduin »

So, just to recap, the 1st 100 was comprised of 21 unindexed characters of my choosing, 6 new LotR index inclusions by Hammond & Scull, 2 statues indexed once as 1 character, 6 females indexed under male counterparts, 49 names on family-trees, 8 minimal Bombadil poem characters, 7 minimal LotR-draft characters, and of course that lovable Attercop.

The next 100 will slowly crack the textual legendarium with the most obscure characters of HoMe/UT, arranged by their # of pages indexed. I said I wasn’t going to be ‘batching-together’ characters within those of the same score anymore, well not true. That is, the remaining forty-six 2pt characters each take up only 1 index line, but their # of indexed pages vary from 1 to 12, and I'll be arranging them by this factor, from least pages to most.

I should say, before continuing on, that characters will appear here, from 2 or 3 ‘cycles’ that essentially stand outside the ‘mythology’ and within real-world history (or future), serving as vehicles for the transmission of his tales. Tolkien always had a framework for this in mind, as his tales until the very end had an Ælfwine (Elf-friend) present in one of either of these of our centuries: the 5th (from the beginning of his writings until the outside limit of the mid-40’s) or 9th (from the early 20’s to the very end of his writings).

Thus there was a gradual overlap between these 2 notions, but a key note from 1945/6 (in the very midst of writing LotR) is a clear indicator of when he shifted over finally from one to the other. From this note, these ‘cycles’ were coined the ERIOL-SAGA, the story of a traveller (from 5th-century Denmark) named Eriol who discovers the Straight Road, Eressëa, and eventually the ‘Lost Tales’; and the ‘ATLANTIS STORY’, which (began as the ‘Lost Road’, but) became the ‘Notion Club Papers’, a 1980’s group of Oxford scholars (based on the ‘Inklings), who were to ultimately envision the travels of an Ælfwine of England (of the 9th-century) and apparently link him to the tales of the ‘Fall of Númenór’ and ‘the Silmarillion’. This last idea survived after the pressures of the publication of LotR forced him to place all this on hold, as Tolkien continued to cite Ælfwine of England hearing the tales from the Elf Pengolođ the Wise in Eressëa in most of his later 'Silmarillion' works.

The inclusions of the characters involved in these ‘cycles’ was due to my necessary including all of Tolkien’s writings, to let the cream rise to the top non-artificially, as no one has the authority (or the time, for that matter), certainly not me, to pick-&-choose amongst them (Christopher has tried more than once with limited success). In the end, yes, the 3 most prominent characters intended as the ultimate transmitters of his tales (outside hobbits of course) will appear in the top 250.

Having said all this, this is not a scholarly project, but one of fun, please bear this in mind; I’ve thrown all the sh** against the wall, and we’ll see what sticks where.

So, here’s the first half of characters with a mere 1 indexed page in UT/HoMe, and as you’ll see, these 10 barely exist outside of notes, lists & scratches.

#1100 Heden grandfather of Eriol
No corresponding text, merely notebook jottings for this progenitor, but he is an appropriate starting point. Heden ‘the leather and fur clad’ had sons Eoh and Beorn; Eoh’s son was Ottor; and Ottor’s sons, by his 1st wife, were Hengest and Horsa. Ottor of course was later given the name Eriol, and will appear much later in this countdown.

#1099 Oswin Lowdham grandfather of Arundel Lowdham
Likewise, this progenitor appropriately comes next, and appears only in a semi-speculative footnote by Christopher Tolkien. He is, nonetheless, the first Notion Club character to appear, though not a Club member proper; and his grandson, the highest ranking of the Notion Club Papers, will also appear much later.

#1098 Gorgumoth hound of Mandos
Only a note in a notebook, but at one time Mandos had a hound, with no discernable connection to Huan. Gorgumoth guarded Melkor, bound in a place called Lumbi, after he was overthrown in battle by Tulkas. Classified as a ‘guard’, he’s already the 5th of 11 canines on the list.

#1097 Torhir Ifant maker of the Dorgannas Iaur
Within the development of the chapter ‘Of Beleriand and its Realms’, its stated that “these matters [were] taken from the Dorgannas Iaur (the account of the shapes of the lands of old that Torhir Ifant made and is kept in Eressëa)”. This was possibly meant to be the Beleriand version to Rúmil’s 'Ambarkanta', as Pengolođ’s ‘Annals of Beleriand’ were to Rúmil’s ‘Annals of Aman’. Nevertheless we have the 1st Elf to appear, classified speculatively as a Noldo loremaster, and probably a member of the Lambengolmor of Eressëa, as was Pengolođ.

#1096 Morwen daughter of Húrin of the Keys
She it was, that at one time was to be wedded to Éomer. Of course Éomer married Lothiriel, daughter of Imrahil; while Théoden’s mother was named Morwen; and in the end Húrin the Tall, Warden of the Keys, has no mentioned daughter. However, there is nothing that I know of to deny a daughter named Morwen to Húrin of the Keys, so here she is.

#1095 Duilin father of Saelon
Saelon , the young man of Gondor who helped discover the ‘new shadow’ in the story of that name, disappeared at one point, fleeing “northward to the house of his father”. In a footnote, its stated that in draft A its written "his father Duilin". Where exactly he dwelt in this northward direction (or what he did) is of course anybody’s guess, so he’s classified here as a Man of Gondor of unknown occupation.

#1094 Colombo Arditi, Tempestosa Professor of Italian
The first member of the Notion Club proper to appear; many more will follow soon. They’re all classified as Europeans, and most as loremasters/professors/writers. This one doesn’t appear to have attended any of the recorded meetings of the Notion Club, thus no textual reference other than the biographical members list; which states that he was born in 1940, is of St. John’s College, and is “fond of (and not unskilled in) singing (basso), swimming, and the game of bowls, [and] collects books and cats.”

#1093 Elulindo son of Olwë
In ‘the Genealogies’ that belong with the earliest ‘Annals of Beleriand’ its stated that Olwë “Lord of the Teleri (who is called ‘Lord of Ships’), has a son Elulindo”. There’s no corresponding text, but there’s also been nothing written since (that I know of) which explicably overturns his existence. In fact, an heir to the King of the 3rd House in Aman, other than Eärwen wife of the King of the 2nd House, might just be more palatable, no?

#1092 Poldor, a Númenórean boy
Appearing only in a 'Lost Road' footnote providing original text, he is one of the “foolish friends” of the young son of Elendil (Herendil>Isildur?). In a second-hand reference only, this Poldor apparently called him Eärendel, mockingly, the day before; to which Elendil of course responds that this is not at all an insult. (The other 3 names in this brief episode naturally all appear well within the top 50).

#1091 Galhir of Brethil
Again, appearing only in a footnote, Galhir was at one occurrence an emendation of the name Sagroth, a Man of Brethil. This alone would have disqualified him for this list, simply being absorbed by the character of Sagroth. However, in this footnote Christopher Tolkien speculates, due to the eventual reinstatement of Sagroth, that “Galhir was perhaps intended to be another member of Manthor’s company, rather than a replacement of the name”. If so, then possibly (story-wise) we can speculate from this that Manthor debated whether to leave Galhir or Sagroth in charge, and in the end settled on Sagroth.

Next week, 2 more Notion Club members, 2 companions of Ælfwine of England, 2 protectors of young Elwing, an Ornil and an Orlin, a servant of Morgoth, and what will no doubt prove to be a controversial daughter of a Noldor King...
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

Though of course I'm looking forward to seeing how the later portions of the list play out, in many ways this is the most interesting part to me, because almost all of these names are ones that I only dimly recall (at best). What an incredible effort this is!
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
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#s 1090-1081

Post by Dân o Nandor on Anduin »

I may have been presumptuous with some of my commentary last week, and so some edits/additions have been made, so please do give it a re-read if so inclined.

Now you’ll be glad to know that we actually have some corresponding text for most of the entries, so here goes the second half of those ‘characters’ with only 1 index line & 1 indexed page:

#1090 Langon servant of Morgoth in Utumno
Sent by Morgoth to entreat the Valar descending within his halls to capture him, this servant says to them “Behold, he was rejoiced and in wonder to see the Gods before his gates. Now would he gladly welcome them, yet for the poverty of his abode not more than two of them could he fitly entertain; and he begged that neither Manwë nor Tulkas be of the two...”. For the rest, consult the richly elaborate ‘Lost Tales’. (I classified him as a miscellaneous Maia soldier).

#1089 Orlin of Hísilómë
Call it irony, but 2 [see below] of the most minor characters (sharing the same 1st syllable, and whose 2nd syllables form a palindrome), separated in Tolkien’s writings by 4 centuries, conveniently pop in to highlight the peaks of Túrin’s rage. Orlin is a Man, of his mother’s kin, that Túrin slew in Brodda’s hall, seemingly needlessly after beheading Brodda, in the Lost Tale ‘Turambar and the Foalókë’.

#1088 Ornil of Nargothrond
Ornil, on the other hand, is an Elf of Nargothrond who, as Túrin was making his way back to that land, and “autumn was passing to a dire winter”, appears literally out of nowhere to exclaim: “Even so fall the people of Nargothrond, but for them there shall come no Spring”. That’s it for Ornil, and right then, on the very same page of the 50’s ‘Grey Annals’, Glaurung and the hosts of Morgoth are breaking down the Gates. Was this the price for Orlin’s slaying in Tolkien’s chronology? Or was OrLIN’s death the price for OrNIL’s prophetic doom within Middle-earth chronology?

#1087 Gereth, Noldo guide of Elwing
Near the end of the tale of ‘the Nauglafring’, after the final ruin of Doriath and death of Dior by the sons of Fëanor, the few survivors fled the destruction, escorting Elwing and the Silmaril out with them. It is said in this Lost Tale (the only detailed authorial narrative of this event), “Evranin the nurse of Elwing [the next entry], and Gereth a Gnome, took her unwilling in a flight swift and sudden from those lands...”. Presumably Gereth was one of the loyal Noldo smiths of Doriath, present in this tale (which would comply, of course, with Galadriel’s later presence).

#1086 Evranin nurse of Elwing in Doriath
See above. (I’ve classified her as a Sinda healer). Interestingly, Eärendil also has a personal nurse in the ‘Fall of Gondolin’, who will appear soon.

#1085 Ceola of Somerset, companion of Ælfwine
This mariner appears in the ‘second sketch’ of Night 70, Thursday, 2 October, 1987 (the last recorded meeting of the Notion Club), the minutes of which Tolkien provided in 2 “brief texts, written very fast in pencil but fortunately just about legible, which give a glimpse of what he had in mind” for the further progress of the NC Papers; that is, “the further tales of Ælfwine and Tréowine” (the last words of Night 69). See more below.

#1084 Geraint of West Wales, companion of Ælfwine
The 2nd of 2 mariners hired by Ælfwine and Tréowine on the night the Danes attack Porlock, when Ælfwine decides to sail away to seek the land “whence King Sheaf came”, or to other parts unknown. These episodes come from the musings of Alwin [Ælfwine] Arundel Lowdham, along with Wilfrid Trewin [Tréowine] Jeremy of the Notion Club.

#1083 Dr. Abel Pitt, Bishop of Buckingham
A member of the Notion Club, although not recorded as having attended any meetings. His biography, given in the members list, states he was born in 1928, and is of Trinity College of which he was formerly Chaplain. He is listed as a scholar and occasional poet (but I’ve classified him as a healer – one of 7 on the list).

#1082 Sir Gerald Manface, Lawyer
Also a member of the Notion Club, and not recorded as having attended any meetings. He is given as being of All Souls College, as well as a much travelled mountaineer. He has many children, for whom he has written many (unpublished) books and tales. It also says that he seldom appears, is not resident in Oxford, but is a special friend of regular member Philip Frankley. (I’ve classified him as a lawyer – one of 5 on the list).

#1081 Elmar, mother of Hazad Longbeard
She was the forced wife of Buldar [see #971], and “a woman of few words while her life lasted, save only to her children [and to] them she spoke much when none were by, and she sang to them many songs in a strange fair tongue; but they heeded her not, or soon forgot [s]ave only Hazad, the youngest; and though he was, as were all her children, unlike her in body, he was nearer to her in heart”. She gets 2pts for 1 index line in HoMe12.

Next, characters with *double* the # of indexed pages (but still only 1 index line)!
Last edited by Dân o Nandor on Anduin on Tue Dec 28, 2010 4:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

Time for another installment, no?
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
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Post by Griffon64 »

I would hope so - I'm enjoying following along!
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#s 1080-1071

Post by Dân o Nandor on Anduin »

When I began this April 12, the same date of the beginning of the ‘Great Years’ of the War of the Ring, I said this list would occur over real-time until the passing of the Ring-bearers. We’re only now at the time, Mid-year’s Day, that Gandalf meets Radagast; and shortly, before my next post, Boromir will have set out from Minas Tirith. So the list, ever so slowly, moves forward...

#1080 Gilbarad great-grandfather of Aragorn
In the draft of the ‘Tale of Aragorn and Arwen’, Ivorwen’s father, Aragorn’s great-grandfather on his mother’s side, was named. Left on the cutting-room floor, but neither replaced or dismissed in any textual capacity, you decide in your mind if he’s still on the ‘tree’. If you decide he’s not, that’s absolutely wonderful, but he’s #1080 on this list.

#1079 Narthseg, a wild Elf
In the tale of ‘The Nauglafring’, Narthseg “whose name is bitter to the Eldar yet”, tipped off Naugladur, lord of the ‘bad’ dwarves of Nogrod, to Thingol’s hunting schedule, which eventually led to ruin of the kingdom. Of the 3 destructions of the Elven kingdoms - the Sack, Ruin, and Fall – it’s fitting, I think, to have one of them free of either Morgoth’s or Túrin’s direct involvement; and to have Elves, Men, and Dwarves at each other’s throats, complete with carnage and bloodshed, playing into the attitude between the 3 peoples in LotR (ie. Celeborn & Gimli). Narthseg was but a bit-player in the original (and only) full and bloody story. (I’ve classified Narthseg as Avari, the 1st of 10 who will appear).

#1078 Nielthi handmaid of Melian
“Wherefore, O Lady, art thou sorrowful at the hightide of the king?” asks the 4th character to appear here from ‘The Nauglafring’, to which Melian answers, “Evil seeks our land, and my heart misgives me... I wish never to have wandered forth from Valinor”. Nielthi asks “hast thou not woven great magic all about us, so that we fear not”, to which Melian again responds “there is a rat that gnaws the threads and all the web has come unwoven”. At that, Naugladur struts into the chamber in front of Melian wearing the Necklace of the Dwarves (with the Silmaril), bearing Thingol’s decapitated crowned head. Ah, the ‘Lost Tales’...

#1077 Nan the Giant
Speaking of Thingol, in the ‘Lay of Leithian’, after being imprisoned high in the tree Hirilorn by her father, Lúthien sang her magic song of escape. In it, she sang of “all names of things tallest and longest on earth”, which included the tail of Draugluin, the body of Glaurung, the hair of Uinen, and as it happens, the sword of Nan.

#1076 Ithilbor father of Saeros
We’ve so far introduced the Noldor, the Sindar, and the Avari, so now the 1st of the 4 Nandor, the least-appearing of the Elf clans on the list. In the ‘Narn’ in UT, it was established that Saeros “was of the Nandor, being one of those who took refuge in Doriath after the fall of their lord Denethor... they were no friends to the Edain since their passage through Ossiriand”. And Ithilbor’s son was certainly no friend to Túrin.

#1075 Finntann the oldest man
I previously forgot to mention Finntan with the 3 names crossing over from real-world pseudo-history to Tolkien’s Story. But Ælfwine of England, back from Eressëa, was eventually to settle in Ireland, leading to the story of Finntan the “oldest man in the world... according to mediaeval Irish annalists”.

#1074 Céolwulf father of Tréowine
Tréowine, a companion of Ælfwine of England, appeared last week, mentioned under their listed hired hands. His father was Céolwulf, who “claimed to come of the kin of the kings that sat at Tamworth [in Mercia] of old; but Tréowine had come south many years before”.

#1073 Almáriel a Númenórean girl
We had Poldor, the boy, 2 weeks ago. Now is a girl, in which the chastised son of Elendil compares himself simply for height: “I stand barely to the shoulder of Almáriel, whose hair is of shining gold, and she is a maiden, and of my own age.” She also appears, due to her name, under the listing GALA- (‘thrive, prosper’; almárea ‘blessed’), in the ‘Etymologies’.

#1072 Othrondir of Gondor
Othrondir is a man of Fourth Age Gondor who “had spoken of” rumours that Borlas had remembered in his conversations with Saelon: “It was he who had used the word ‘canker’.” I ask you, what would the legendarium be without Othrondir of Gondor? The New Shadow would never have been aptly described as a canker!

#1071 Cwén 1st wife of Eriol
Cwén is Old English for ‘woman/wife’. She was also the mother of Hengest and Horsa, and died an early death. Eriol then left his 2 sons, who “avenged Eoh and became great chieftains”, to depart for se uncú Þa holm, ‘the unknown island’.

Off hand, I have no idea who's going to appear next week...
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

Neither do I. ;) (Only that it will be interesting.)
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

Did we miss a week? I've lost track. Still looking forward to the next installment!
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
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#s1070-1061

Post by Dân o Nandor on Anduin »

Missed another week, oh well, it’ll all fit. The following 10 characters, still of 2pts (1 index-line), progress from 2-5 indexed pages, and they are all very obscure.

Consider this like a top 1000 rock songs list - I’ve listened to my share – which gets kicked off by Louie Louie by the Kingsmen, then proceeds thru the Do You Believe In Magic?’s by the Lovin’ Spoonfuls, the Kicks’s by the Paul Revere & the Raiders’s, and the I’m Henry the VIII, I Am’s by the Herman’s Hermits’s (about where we are now), before moving on to the Eye Of The Tiger’s by the Survivors, the In-a-Gadda-da-Vida’s by the Iron Butterfly’s, and the We’re An American Band’s by the Grand Funk Railroads. It makes it that much more special when we get to the Bohemian Rhapsody’s, the Highway To Hell’s, and the Stairway To Heaven’s.

#1070 Orontor of Númenor
From the ‘Lost Road’, he is the father of #1061, listed last here. He happened to be away “on a long voyage... a mission from which he might never return”, which Christopher Tolkien footnotes: “seems like a premonition of the voyage of Amandil into the West”. Elendil loved Orontor, and some Númenoreans said he “fled the displeasure of the king”. But as a result, he left his daughter behind to dwell within Elendil’s household. More on her down the list...

#1069 Tareg the Ilkorin
For this (and the following) Elf, we go back to the ‘Book of Lost Tales I’ where Ilkorins (Úmanyar) 1st appear. At this time, they were comprised of “some [who] fell out upon the way [of the March], or were lost... but the most were those who left not [Cuiviénen] at all”. Thus, I’ve classified Tareg (and Mablon below) as Avari, since they appear at the end of the tale of the ‘Awakening of Men’ in the east, which came on the heels of the tale of Nuin the Dark Elf. Here it is said that the “hosts of Tareg the Ilkorin marched North-west hearing a rumour of the [Noldor]; and many of the lost kindreds joined him... [and they] found the [Noldor] at the Feast of Reunion”; which leads to a mention of Tareg and his Ilkorins in an early account of the Battle of Unnumbered Tears.

#1068 Mablon the Ilkorin
In this early account, according to CT, nearing the end of said Battle, “Turgon was pursued, and there is a reference to ‘Mablon the Ilkorin’s sacrifice to save the host’... [in the later outline, Melkor] sent his host of Balrogs after them, and Mablon the Ilkorin died to save them”. Both Mablon and Tareg are classified as soldiers.

#1067 Rosamunda wife of Alboin the Lombard
(The list of semi-historical characters crossing over to Tolkien’s Story keeps growing, so I’ll just stop the count). Rosamunda is not only the 1st character on this list from the ‘opening chapters’ cycle of the ‘Lost Road’, but she’s from the story-within-the-story: that is, the story of the 6th-century Lombards (taken from Paul the Deacon’s Historia Langobardorum), told by one Oswin Errol to his son Alboin Errol. In it, Alboin the Lombard King tries to poison his wife Rosamunda, who in turn murders him in his bed and buries his body under a staircase. Oswin apparently “ended the story, and did not tell his son how Rosamunda exacted her revenge“, applying some parental discretion to this bedtime story it seems.

#1066 Norman Keeps
(The next 2 entrants should technically be reversed, as Norman has 3 indexed pages, and Oswine only 2, but I couldn’t resist him at this #). Indexed as an “uninstructed barber” in the ‘Notion Club Papers’, CT footnotes: “Norman Keeps was an historical person, who expounded to my father the view of English history here recounted by Philip Frankley while plying his trade at the barbering establishment of Weston and Cheal in the Turl Street”. As Notion Club-member Frankley says, “Norman Keeps is our barber, [a]t least that’s what Arry and I call him: no idea what his real name is. Quite a nice and moderately intelligent little man: but to him everything beyond a certain vague distance back is a vast dark barren but utterly fixed and determined land and time called The Dark Ages”.

#1065 Óswine Prince of Gwar
Old English for ‘god-friend’, Óswine is the Prince of Kortirion, also known as Gwar (and Warwick), in the earliest story of Ælfwine of England. He was “a lover of songs and no enemy of the Elves” who lingered yet about Gwar. Déor, father of Ælfwine, came to seek him and “the companies of the Fading Elves”, having married Éadgifu (see #1062 below). But Men of the North came down and sacked the town, killing Ælfwine’s parents, leaving the boy a thrall, and “none of Elves or Men were left in his old halls to lament the fall of Óswine Prince of Gwar”.

#1064 Great Pine of Tavrobel
When the Vanyar settled Tol Eressëa, they were given a seed from Yavanna but it “must be guarded, for great tidings would one day come of its growth. But it was forgotten, and cast in the garden of Gilfanon, and a mighty pine arose that reached to Ilwë and the stars”. Eventually the sons of Tulkas and Ingwë pursue an escaped Melkor up the tree to the stars and guard him, and then the Great Pine is “cut down to keep him out of the world”. It is said that in Tavrobel (Great Haywood) “grows still the child of the child of the Pine” of Yavanna.

#1063 Zamîn
She was in the service of Erendis in Númenor, “an old country-woman, free-tongued, and not easily daunted, even by the White Lady”. She is termed “an old crone” in the text when she meets Aldarion and his mariners back from their ventures, saying “There is no lodging for you here. Go down to the homestead at the hill’s foot!” To Ulbar’s rebuff and query, she says “Your son has eaten himself out of your memory. But go, and find your own answers! You’ll be warmer there than your Captain”. She later helps Ancalimë, the daughter of Aldarion and Erendis, “into hiding at a farm on the borders of the lands of Hallatan of Hyarastorni, where she lived for a time the life of a shepherdess”. The results of this are open to speculation, and can be consulted at the end of ‘The Mariner’s Wife’ tale in UT.

#1062 Éadgifu of Lionesse
She’s the mother of Ælfwine of England, from the west, who married the singer Déor of the south of England. As said above, she was killed in the sack of Gwar.

#1061 Fíriel of Númenor
See above. Fíriel was a fair maiden of Elendil’s household in Númenor, left to dwell there after her father departed. She “sang an even-song in the Eressëan tongue, but made by men, long ago... Ilu Ilúvatar en káre eldain a fírimoin / ar antaróta mannar Valion: númessier... [The father made the World for elves and mortals, and he gave it into the hands of the Lords, who are in the West]. So sang Fíriel on high, until her voice fell sadly to the question with which that song ends: man tare antáva nin Ilúvatar, Ilúvatar, enyáre tar i tyel ire Anarinya qeluva? [What will Ilúvatar, O Ilúvatar, give me in that day beyond the end, when my Sun faileth?]”. A CT footnote gives a much longer verse and description.

Until next time...
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Re: #s1070-1061

Post by N.E. Brigand »

Dân o Nandor on Anduin wrote:Consider this like a top 1000 rock songs list - I’ve listened to my share – which gets kicked off by Louie Louie by the Kingsmen [#2 in 1963] then proceeds thru the Do You Believe In Magic?’s by the Lovin’ Spoonfuls [#9 in 1965], the Kicks’s by the Paul Revere & the Raiders’s [#4 in 1966], and the I’m Henry the VIII, I Am’s by the Herman’s Hermits’s [#1 in 1965] (about where we are now), before moving on to the Eye Of The Tiger’s by the Survivor's [#1 in 1982], the In-a-Gadda-da-Vida’s by the Iron Butterfly’s [#30 in 1968], and the We’re An American Band’s by the Grand Funk Railroads [#1 in 1973]. It makes it that much more special when we get to the Bohemian Rhapsody’s [#9 in 1976; #2 in 1992], the Highway To Hell’s [#47 in 1979], and the Stairway To Heaven’s [did not chart (1971)].
So wait, the list is backwards?! "Louie, Louie" managed to rank "#55 on Rolling Stone list of The 500 Greatest Songs of All Time", according to wikipedia. And in the quote above, I interpolate into your song list the top weekly position on Billboard's U.S. "Hot 100" list for each entry. My favorite of your selection is the Spoonful's song.
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

Yeah, well what does Rolling Stone know about Tolkien? ;)
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Post by Inanna »

Ah, I remember Zamin....
'You just said "your getting shorter": you've obviously been drinking too much ent-draught and not enough Prim's.' - Jude
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Post by Dân o Nandor on Anduin »

Ah NEB, your depth in music appreciation rivals that of your depth in Tolkien appreciation. I never realized how much limiting musical tastes to Top-40 Billboard weekly countdowns, parallels limiting Tolkien’s legendarium to the ’77 Silmarillion. Well, you can let Casey Kasem, and Christopher Tolkien of the mid-70’s (not to mention Guy Kay), spoonfeed you the stuff of the masses, I’ll follow the true geniuses to the end, thank you. :)

On that note...

The first 5 of the following 10 characters are the last ones with 2pts (1 index-line) and progress from 6 to 12 indexed pages; the last 5 begin 3pt characters.

#1060 Elentir brother of Amandil
In ‘The History of the Akallabêth’ Christopher T notes, “The significance of Amandil’s brother Elentir will be seen in the texts given here: so far as I am aware he appears nowhere else”. Elentir loved Tar-Míriel and they were to be betrothed, but in these drafts she actually had eyes early on for the Golden One: “when [Tar-Míriel] saw Pharazộn in the splendour of his young manhood come riding in... Suddenly [her] heart turned towards him”. CT says these sketches “in fact followed the writing of the long rider to the Akallabêth, and they represent the emergence of a doubt in my father’s mind whether the marriage [of Ar-Pharazộn to Tar-Míriel] was indeed ‘against her will’, and the sketching of a new story on the subject”.

#1059 Eädwine son of Ælfwine
Ælfwine’s son appears in notes for the ‘Lost Road’, and was to be a part of the father-son storyline of legendary times. In the sketches, Ælfwine awaits Eadwine’s return on the night of the attack of the Danes on Porlock in the autumn of 915, at which time they converse about the possibility of a Straight Road. “In the end they go off with ten neighbours” and have adventures, but unlike Eriol, they only apparently glimpse visions of the Straight Road and Eressëa.

#1058 Mogru the Master of Agar
The 1st character to appear here from the tale of ‘Tal-Elmar’, the last tale in HoMe, which tells of the coming of the Númenóreans from the point of view of the Men of Middle-earth. Mogru, “a fat man with eyes like a lizard”, is Master of the town of the young Tal-elmar, who says Mogru “will be a master without people, or a bag of bones on the hillside, if he scorns the wisdom of Hazad” father of the boy, who brings news of the ships off the coast. At this Mogru, who hates the boy and his father, becomes enraged but is begrudgingly led to see the ships for himself. The Master then sends Tal-elmar alone to spy on the ships at close range, to which the boy thinks it “might well be that I who am a stranger in my own people should find them more pleasing than Mogru and all others like him”. Tal-elmar meets the strangers, but unfortunately the tale goes unfinished.

#1057 Oikeroi thane of Tevildo
In the ‘Tale of Tinúviel’, Sauron was in his early incarnation as Tevildo Prince of Cats, and one of his thanes was Oikeroi “a fierce and warlike cat... [who] had aforetime been much about the halls of Melko”. He bore Lúthien on his back, but met his fate by the jaws of Huan, and his skin was kept as a trophy by those two. Admittedly, much of his role was transferred to Draugluin, but as a cat and thane I deem his character stands enough apart to warrant inclusion; and since I deleted the Cat of the Shire poem, I’ve kept all 3 cats of Tevildo!

#1056 Borlas of Pen-arduin
‘Old Borlas’ is one of the 2 main characters of ‘The New Shadow’, along with young Saelon, and dwells in a “small grey-stone house” with a garden, in the hills of Ithilien. The story that emerges is largely dialogue between the 2, during which Borlas looks “with amazement and fear” when Saelon utters the name of ‘Herumor’ while discussing the potential return of Evil to Gondor. Borlas it was also who, at the very end of this unfinished tale, “smelt the old Evil and knew it for what it was".

#1055 Barrow-wight waiting for Frodo
“Here! I am waiting for you” says the first 3pt character, awarded 2pts for 2 indexed pages in Drout’s Encyclopedia, as well as a single point for the 3 lines indexed as Barrow-wight(s) in LotR: 2 lines I’ve offset for the plural, which I discount. This “tall dark figure like a shadow against the stars [with] two eyes, very cold though lit with a pale light that seemed to come from some remote distance” is the 7th of 12 Undead Men that will appear, and the 1st non-Nazgûl. “Cold be hand and heart and bone, and cold be sleep under stone...

#1054 the Lonely Troll
An earlier version of Shrek, this Troll who ‘steals no gold, drinks no beer, and eats no kind of meat’ finds himself alone and weeping outside the Shire’s Lockholes gate, when little Perry-the-Winkle shows up. They go back to Winkle’s home, where the Troll bakes pikelets, cakes, and beautiful cransome bread. He teaches bakery and feeds the young one until he “grew so fat through eating of cransome bread, his weskit bust, and never a hat would sit upon his head”. The 2nd of 5 trolls to appear gets his 3pts for 3 lines in Foster’s Guide.

#1053 Kuruki the magician
In notes for the Lost Tale of ‘Turambar and the Foalókë’, it was Kuruki that induces Morwen and Nienor into forgetfulness with a “baneful drink”. Though his essential role was taken over by Glaurung, as with Oikeroi/Draugluin, I’ve also opted to keep this one due to his uniqueness of character. The extra point awarded, beyond the 2pts for 1 HoMe index line, is for being listed in the ‘Names in the Lost Tales’ Appendix for the etymology of his name: kuru ‘magic, wizardry’. (I’ve classified him as a miscellaneous Maia wizard).

#1052 Yávien niece of Tar-Amandil
This eldest child of Nolondil, younger brother of Tar-Amandil, receives a point for her appearance on the ‘Line of Elros’ family-tree, as well as 2pts for a paragraph in Wikipedia, which speculates that “the prefix yáv means fruit, so Yávien was probably named after Yavanna”. She completes the non-narrative names found only on that tree.

#1051 Meleth nurse of Eärendil
In the ‘Fall of Gondolin’, Meleth was Eärendil’s nurse who is said to have woven him tales “concerning fiery Melko at times of his waywardness” which troubled the boy. For this reason, Idril gave her son the “tiny coat of mail that she had let fashion in secret”. An extra point was awarded to her for her name appearing in the ‘Names in the Lost Tales’ Appendix, although it is simply etymological. She is one of 7 healers appearing.

Well, we’re now one eighth of the way through the list.
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

Dân o Nandor on Anduin wrote:The last 5 begin 3pt characters.
:woohoo:
Well, we’re now one eighth of the way through the list.
:woohoo:

As someone who (with some validity) has been praised for the amount of research and documentation that I did for my own work, let me say how impressed -- nay, overwhelmed -- I am by the amount of research and documentation that is being displayed here. I hope people appreciate just how special this really is.

I hope to have some more substantive comments about these entries later.
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Post by Teremia »

No substantive comments from me -- just a lot of grateful swooning!
:bow:
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

Time for a new installment!
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
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Re: #s 1080-1071

Post by sador »

Well, this is the first time I am using quotes in this board - so I might get some things wrong.

As an aside question - can I quote only one post, or is there a multiquote feature?

Anyway:
Dân o Nandor on Anduin wrote: #1080 Gilbarad great-grandfather of Aragorn
In the draft of the ‘Tale of Aragorn and Arwen’, Ivorwen’s father, Aragorn’s great-grandfather on his mother’s side, was named... If you decide he’s not, that’s absolutely wonderful, but he’s #1080 on this list.
Well, I don't mind adding him.
Also, his name is very interesting, combining the two elements gil-barad. I'm not an expert on Tolkien's languages - does anyone know whether a name with a similar meaning appears elsewhere?

#1079 Narthseg, a wild Elf
In the tale of ‘The Nauglafring’, Narthseg “whose name is bitter to the Eldar yet”, tipped off Naugladur, lord of the ‘bad’ dwarves of Nogrod, to Thingol’s hunting schedule, which eventually led to ruin of the kingdom... I’ve classified Narthseg as Avari, the 1st of 10 who will appear.
Is there any evidence that Narthseg was of the Avari? Also, were Thingol's people considered as Eldar when The Book of Lost Tales was written? [/quote]

#1078 Nielthi handmaid of Melian
“there is a rat that gnaws the threads and all the web has come unwoven”.
A rat? Oh boy.

Was Bilbo a descendant of his, at any rate?
I mean seriously - did Tolkien have any thought of connecting hobbits to Avari - in which case this insult to Narthseg could be used against poor Mr. Baggins?
Or did Melian mean the Dwarves, in which case Thorin hurls at the small elf-friend the insult which Elves used towards his people?
Does Rateliff have anything which might shed a light on this? I haven't read him yet.

#1077 Nan the Giant
Speaking of Thingol, in the ‘Lay of Leithian’, after being imprisoned high in the tree Hirilorn by her father, Lúthien sang her magic song of escape. In it, she sang of “all names of things tallest and longest on earth”, which included the tail of Draugluin, the body of Glaurung, the hair of Uinen, and as it happens, the sword of Nan.
When did Tolkien first come up with the word 'Nan' (as in Nan-Emloth, Nan-Dungortheb)? Is there any connection?

#1076 Ithilbor father of Saeros
In the ‘Narn’ in UT, it was established that Saeros “was of the Nandor, being one of those who took refuge in Doriath after the fall of their lord Denethor... they were no friends to the Edain since their passage through Ossiriand”.
Was Ithilbor mentioned in the Narn, or one of the earlier versions?

#1074 Céolwulf father of Tréowine
Tréowine, a companion of Ælfwine of England, appeared last week, mentioned under their listed hired hands.
You mean he was mentioned in your commentary to the list.
Do you combine Tréowine and Jeremy in your count?

#1072 Othrondir of Gondor
I ask you, what would the legendarium be without Othrondir of Gondor? The New Shadow would never have been aptly described as a canker!
Okay, you've convinced me. :)

#1071 Cwén 1st wife of Eriol
Cwén is Old English for ‘woman/wife’.
Interesting!
So is that the source of names like Gwen?
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Re: #s 1080-1071

Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

sador wrote:Well, this is the first time I am using quotes in this board - so I might get some things wrong.

As an aside question - can I quote only one post, or is there a multiquote feature?
You can quote from multiple posts, but you have to cut and paste to do so.
Also, his name is very interesting, combining the two elements gil-barad. I'm not an expert on Tolkien's languages - does anyone know whether a name with a similar meaning appears elsewhere?
I can't think of any offhand.
I mean seriously - did Tolkien have any thought of connecting hobbits to Avari - in which case this insult to Narthseg could be used against poor Mr. Baggins?

Or did Melian mean the Dwarves, in which case Thorin hurls at the small elf-friend the insult which Elves used towards his people?
Does Rateliff have anything which might shed a light on this? I haven't read him yet.
I can't think of any indication that Tolkien ever thought to connect hobbits to Avari, although that would certainly put an interesting light on the "wild hobbits" that are so prominent in early drafts of LOTR. I do think it is more likely that Melian means the Dwarves, though I don't recall Rateliff saying anything that sheds any light on this (although it's been a while since I've read HotH).
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Re: #s1070-1061

Post by sador »

Dân o Nandor on Anduin wrote:Missed another week, oh well, it’ll all #1070 Orontor of Númenor
He happened to be away “on a long voyage... a mission from which he might never return”, which Christopher Tolkien footnotes: “seems like a premonition of the voyage of Amandil into the West”.
If so, should you have included him?

#1069 Tareg the Ilkorin
Thus, I’ve classified Tareg (and Mablon below) as Avari, since they appear at the end of the tale of the ‘Awakening of Men’ in the east, which came on the heels of the tale of Nuin the Dark Elf.
Well yes, I suppose that classifying Ilkorins as Avari is simple and natural.

#1068 Mablon the Ilkorin
Is he a forerunner of the sons of Bor?
Another question which I haven't checked yet (and haven't got the book here) - does Mablung of the Heavy Hand appear in the Book of Lost Tales? If not, could we see him as a develoement of Mablon?


#1066 Norman Keeps
(The next 2 entrants should technically be reversed, as Norman has 3 indexed pages, and Oswine only 2, but I couldn’t resist him at this #).
:thumbsup:

As Notion Club-member Frankley says, “Norman Keeps is our barber, [a]t least that’s what Arry and I call him: no idea what his real name is. Quite a nice and moderately intelligent little man: but to him everything beyond a certain vague distance back is a vast dark barren but utterly fixed and determined land and time called The Dark Ages”.
And he is also just the type that Zigur (Sauron) could tempt by promises of true knowledge. Curse him!

#1063 Zamîn
“an old country-woman, free-tongued, and not easily daunted, even by the White Lady”. She is termed “an old crone” in the text...
Masculine prejudice!

#1061 Fíriel of Númenor
See above. Fíriel was a fair maiden of Elendil’s household in Númenor, left to dwell there after her father departed.
Oh, I forgot her!
Any connection between her and the two other Firiels - King Arvedui's wife, and the heroine of The Last Ship?
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#s 1050-1041

Post by Dân o Nandor on Anduin »

Sorry, summer delays... all it means is I’ll have to go to blocks of 5 characters starting at #300 instead of #400 (at which time, as addenda to the main list, I’ll also begin to countdown a radio-station composite of the top Classic Rock songs of all-time, due to replies to my post of July 13 on the ‘Hall Of Fire’).

And so glad to see you there sador, I'll answer all your queries when I can.

On with the 2nd eighth of the list... Unless otherwise stated, all 3pt characters (continuing to #1003) receive 2pts for an index line in UT/HoMe, as well as a point for a listing in Wikipedia.

#1050 Mr. Mugwort
Mr. Mugwort, a hobbit of Bree and apparent frequenter of The Prancing Pony, saw Frodo disappear, “or leastways I didn’t see him, if you take my meaning”. Several Mugworts, “an odd name to [the Fellowship’s] way of thinking” were present in the Pony in the LotR drafts. He gets 1pt for being indexed in LotR, as well as 2pts for being indexed in HoMe 6.

#1049 Hiril sister of Beren Erchamion
A controversial entry, no doubt, this daughter of Barahir and Emeldir appears in changes made to ‘Bëor table II’, the final tree we’re given on the genealogy of the 1st House of the Edain composed at the end of the sub-section ‘Of the Kindreds and Houses of the Edain’, found at the end of the chapter ‘Of the Coming of men into the West’ in the ‘Later Quenta Silmarillion’. Thus, unlike Idis daughter of Théoden, no final publication exists to warrant discounting Hiril’s late (post-LotR) appearance in the working cosmology.

#1048 Maidros father of Finwë
Likewise, back in ‘Lost Tales I’, before Fëanor’s son was in existence, his grandfather was named simply as the father of his father. Nothing more to the narrative than that, and since there’s no reference to a father of Finwë anywhere else, one could posit that Fëanor named his firstborn after his grandfather, a ubiquitous progenitor of the Noldor. Or not.

#1047 Amrothos son of Imrahil
The 3rd son of Prince Imrahil of Dol Amroth, found only on the ‘Line of Dol Amroth’ tree in HoMe 12.

#1046 Erchirion son of Imrahil
The 2nd son of Prince Imrahil of Dol Amroth, found only on said line (see above).

#1045 Sagroth
A “woodsman somewhat older and wiser” than Avranc son of Dorlas, and the first person to recognize Húrin after his wanderings, beyond Morwen’s passing. He “looked at him in wonder and was afraid, for he thought he knew who this old man was... ‘Look here! It must be Húrin. The incomers spoke truly. He has come!” “Trust you to find trouble, as ever, Sagroth!” said Forhend, another man of Brethil. It was Sagroth who Manthor left in charge, rather than Galhir (see #1091).

#1044 Gorgol the Butcher
We’re overdue for another orc, and who better than this victim of Beren. “Of hunters hunted, slayers slain / they sang, of Gorgol the Butcher hewn, / of ambush in Ladros, fire in Drun, / of thirty in one battle dead, / of wolves that yelped like curs and fled, / yea, Sauron himself with wound in hand.” CT says of line 519 of the 'Lay of Leithian': “Gorgol the Butcher. He is named nowhere else”. Pity!

#1043 Eoh father of Eriol
Eoh, “a word of the Old English poetic vocabulary meaning ‘horse’”, was a son of Heden (see #1100). His son was Ottor (later to be named Eriol), but Eoh was slain by his brother Beorn. Eriol named the two sons of his 1st marriage, Hengest and Horsa “after his father... to avenge Eoh”. Along with the 2pts for being indexed in HoMe 1, he receives 1pt for being indexed in Drout’s Encyclopedia.

#1042 Gilwen sister of Barahir
She is the 3rd daughter and 4th child of Bregor of the 1st House of the Edain, and older sister of Barahir, thus aunt of Beren Erchamion. Like her younger sister (below) she appears only on the family tree mentioned above.

#1041 Hirwen sister of Barahir
See above. Hirwen is the 2nd daughter of Bregor.

Can’t wait for #300! How bout you?
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