Tolkien Estate Sues New Line, The Hobbit Not Yet Threatened

For discussion of the upcoming films based on The Hobbit and related material, as well as previous films based on Tolkien's work
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kams
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Post by kams »

My head is spinning.....
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Voronwë the Faithful
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

The lawyers have taken over. =:)
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Post by Primula Baggins »

What thread will be next? :scarey:
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
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Post by Alatar »

I'm still waiting for the translation. Babelfish doesn't do Lawyer-> English yet.
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Post by solicitr »

Correction: apparently the contract specifies that New York law will control. This inclines to the plaintiffs' favor, since NY tends to be a stickler for up-and-up accounting practices (unlike California).
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Post by Erunáme »

Alatar wrote:I'm still waiting for the translation. Babelfish doesn't do Lawyer-> English yet.


:rofl:
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Post by solicitr »

Vor, as I mentioned on TORC as well, the paragraph requesting declaratory relief does say "without prejudice to the rights of innocent parties." In other words, "we don't want to screw Saul Zaentz." In that case, I think, the Hobbit license would just go back up the chain, so to speak. Certainly New Line has the tactical option to try to sell them back to Zaentz and get something rather than nothing.


I believe that CA has abolished the law/equity distinction, right? In which case the court is free to reform the contract however it sees fit in the interests of justice.

However, I don't know if NY maintains the distinction or not, or what it means today (in VA the distinction is still pretty rigorous).
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

solicitr wrote:Vor, as I mentioned on TORC as well, the paragraph requesting declaratory relief does say "without prejudice to the rights of innocent parties." In other words, "we don't want to screw Saul Zaentz." In that case, I think, the Hobbit license would just go back up the chain, so to speak. Certainly New Line has the tactical option to try to sell them back to Zaentz and get something rather than nothing.
Ah! Good catch (I only skimmed the Complaint). That does seem to be be a pretty strong indicator.
I believe that CA has abolished the law/equity distinction, right? In which case the court is free to reform the contract however it sees fit in the interests of justice.
Yes, that is true, but irrelevant since NY law prevails. That's always weird when a court of one jurisdiction has to enforce the laws of another.

Folks, sorry for all of the legalese. I'd be happy to try to answer any specific question that people are confused about (if I can).
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Post by Primula Baggins »

Well, most of our burning questions are probably unanswerable (yet), anyway.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
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Post by solicitr »

Vor, do you or your LA contact know if the original contracts have been filed? (here it's a filing requirement for any contract action).
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

soli, I don't have an L.A. contact. I downloaded the Complaint from the L.A. Superior Court website. So far as I know, that is all that has been filed (yes, I paid the fee). What I sent to you was all that they had.
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Post by eborr »

Primula Baggins wrote:I'm sure it would be Greek to me, Voronwë, so I'll wait for your comments (and those of others who understand it, too, of course).
I used to be able to read Greek, as opposed to lawyerese, fortunately there is no simple Greek translation for "huge fees"
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Post by Primula Baggins »

Well, fair's fair; there's probably no lawyerese for "rosy-fingered Aurora."
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
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Post by solicitr »

Sure there is!

That goddess or demigoddess (without necessarily imputing gender) at some times identified by the Latin name Aurora (without prejudice to other names which may be or at previous times have been applied in Greek nor to cognate gods/goddesses existing or formerly existing in the cultural mythologies of other cultures including, but not limited to, Persian, Babylonian, Sumerian, Assyrian, Akkadian, Thracian, and/or Celtic); characterised by 'fingers' (without hereby alleging that said god/goddess necessarily maintains at all or any times an anthropomorphic form) of a roseate color falling within the range of of electromagnetic wavelengths defined by the American Physical Institute as "red", without thereby alleging that the said god/goddess is possessed at any or all times of visibly identifiable color in the extremities (assuming without alleging that such extremities do or do not exist).
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Post by Alatar »

:bow:
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Post by Primula Baggins »

:rotfl:
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
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Post by kams »

eborr wrote:I used to be able to read Greek, as opposed to lawyerese, fortunately there is no simple Greek translation for "huge fees"
τεράστιες αμοιβές*


from AltaVista BabelFish. I have no idea if it is correct.


and, well done solicitr!
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Post by solicitr »

It's interesting: CRT and the Estate might now benefit from having refrained from public criticism of Jackson and the movies, since PJ may prove to be a valuable ally, or at least co-belligerent: his testimony and Wingnut Films' books could well sink New Lines' claimed 'production costs.'

And of course more reason why the Estate wouldn't want to do anything to block PJ from The Hobbit.

Honest to goodness I am starting to form a prediction- PJ directs Hobbit personally, 12-18 months behind the current schedule, for MGM/UA.
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

Honest to goodness I am starting to form a prediction- PJ directs Hobbit personally, 12-18 months behind the current schedule, for MGM/UA.
Almost exactly a year ago, not long after it was announced that Jackson was out of the Hobbit, I wrote:
I've already gone on record as saying that Peter Jackson WILL make the Hobbit, with Howard Shore providing the soundtrack. I suspect that it will be made in around 2009 or 2010, and released in 2010 or 2011.
http://www.thehalloffire.net/forum/view ... 5893#65893
It's interesting: CRT and the Estate might now benefit from having refrained from public criticism of Jackson and the movies, since PJ may prove to be a valuable ally, or at least co-belligerent: his testimony and Wingnut Films' books could well sink New Lines' claimed 'production costs.'
Although I bet there is a pretty strong non-disparagement provision in the settlement agreement between PJ and New Line that would prevent him from saying anything or providing any information absent a court order.

I still believe that to be true.
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Post by solicitr »

But it's entirely possible that by *sheer accident* a copy of Wingnut's books might just be in PJ's LA agent's office where it's open to a California subpoena DT......
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