Live Free or Die Hard... really?

[MithLuin]

It is true that Tolkien didn't much like Dorothy Sayers' novels. But on the other hand, he had many loyal female students who sat in the front row of his lectures. So, I seriously doubt he was spouting anti-woman or contemptuous ideas. He wrote Arwen and Goldberry, true, but also Galadriel and Éowyn. I don't see him as one-sided in his views; just realistic about mortality of women in the cultures he was describing.


I think there is a lot of value in being a good mother and raising a family. But I don't connect that to whether or not you work at home or outside the home. My Mom quit her full time job when I was born, true - but she ran a farm for the next 7 years, so I've never connected 'stay-at-home' with 'not-working'


As soon as you mandate morality, you rob the person's choice of its value. Then, even if they are good, it is 'just following orders' good rather than 'I choose this' good. For integrity to be commended, it really does have to be freely chosen by the person.

I do think that truth is absolute, and that actions can be labeled good or bad. Some things are trickier than others, causing moral dilemmas, but seriously - for most of the choices we face each day, it's fairly clear what the good, honorable thing would be to do. The trickier questions come in when there is a 'damned if you do, damned if you don't' dynamic - for instance, if you offer someone trust, and then punish them for violating it - maybe you shouldn't have offered it in the first place? In other words, there are times when giving someone (I'm thinking of children, obviously) freedom of choice is setting them up for failure. So was it good to give them the trust and freedom, or irresponsible to do so when they weren't ready for it? Questions like that have debatable answers.

But whether or not we cut off someone while driving, show up for work on time, do what we're supposed to do, etc...these are all kinda obvious things.

[Primula Baggins]

I don't think Tolkien was contemptuous of women, either, Mith; Éowyn's despair and Arwen's hard choice could not have been imagined or described by someone who felt that way. (Such as C. S. Lewis. )

I don't "read" these attitudes in LotR at all, and I did not realize he had so many female students. It's just the whole donnish . . . thing, with the silent helpmeet and tea right on time and the children kept quiet so the scholar can concentrate. Or he lives in his rooms and avoids the whole brangle. If that doesn't apply to Tolkien, hurray.