A question

[vison]

Are Rastafarians Christians?

[Voronwë the Faithful]

Yes and no. Most Rasta's believe that Jesus Christ was an incarnation of God on Earth. But they also believe that Haile Selassie (Ras Tafari) was an incarnation of God on Earth (a claim strongly disputed by Haile Salassie himself, a devout Christian). Rastafarians believe that the teachings of Jesus Christ have been distorted in Babylon, their pejorative term for Western society. But they do believe in those teachings.

I doubt most Christians would consider Rastafarians Christian.

I myself have a strong attraction to many Rastafarian elements, though I no longer use Ganja as a sacrament (or for any other purpose), and I despise many of their attitudes about women.

Luciano, who many in Jamaica consider to be Bob Marley's true successor (and who is one of my favorite artists and big influence on me), has a particularly strong Christian influence, though he is Rastafarian through and through.

[vison]

Thanks.

My grandson T absolutely loves Bob Marley's music. He is forever asking me questions about Marley and Rastafarianism, etc., and I am woefully ignorant.

I knew about Haile Selassie and have always meant to look further into the whys and wherefores of that particular belief.

[solicitr]

In particular, the Rastas have latched onto the Ethiopian belief that their monarchs, culminating with Haile Salasse, are the lineal descendants of Solomon and the Queen of Sheba and thus represent the true House of David. However there is also a heapin' helpin' of pan-Africanism, Marcus Garvey being considered a prophet on a par with Moses and Jesus.

[MithLuin]

Basically, yes, what Voronwë said. They might consider themselves to be Christian, in the sense that they have some beliefs centered on Christ, but most Christians would see them as syncretists, because they have blended Christianity with other, often conflicting, beliefs. I think there is some Hinduism in there?

Therefore, they are not considered Christians, though I would ask them what they consider themselves to be before applying any labels.

Another example would be voodoo - practicioners often consider themselves to be semi-Catholic as well, but Catholics do not consider voodoo to be a valid part of their faith/religious practices.

[axordil]

I would put them on the far end of the syncretic spectrum. All religions more than ten minutes old are syncretic to some extent, after all.

[nerdanel]

...which raises the interesting meta-question: if group A perceives itself as a subgroup of group B, but the remainder of group B (or at least many other members of group B) don't agree that group A is validly a part of group B, to whose opinion is deference required?

That is, if Rastafarians did deem themselves "Christian," but other "Christians" (let's use Catholics as an example) are quite clear that Rastafarians don't conform to their understanding of what it means to be Christian, how should a neutral third-party (e.g. an interested Jew or Hindu) consider Rastafarians?

We saw a heated version of this dialogue at HoF years ago with respect to "Jews for Jesus." Are they religiously Jewish because they so consider themselves, or non-Jewish because another group of people (commonly known as "Jews") disputes whether their views are religiously Jewish?

Sorry for the quasi-osgiliation - just typing out loud.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

We had another, similar discussion, regarding whether Mormons were Christians. It is an interesting topic.

[MithLuin]

Yeah, it does get a bit messy. Belief-wise, Christians must believe that God is Trinity and that Jesus (who is God and Man) accomplished our salvation by his life, death and resurrection (in a nutshell). If a person cannot recite the Apostles' Creed without redefining words, they probably have non-Christian beliefs.

Generally, I tend to let people decide what they want to be called, and then try to honor that. But...that can get tricky. People may want to call themselves Christians, but then start some weird cult where everyone has to worship them and have sex with them. At this point, the thread connecting them to 'Christianity' is pretty well and truly severed, regardless of what name they might adopt.

Luckily, the Rastafarians call themselves...Rastafarians. So, they have their own name for themselves, and can certainly acknowledge their Christian heritage while distancing themselves from it on some points.

[solicitr]

Belief-wise, Christians must believe that God is Trinity and that Jesus (who is God and Man) accomplished our salvation by his life, death and resurrection (in a nutshell). If a person cannot recite the Apostles' Creed without redefining words, they probably have non-Christian beliefs.

Um, not really, at least historically. The Arians were certainly Christians, even if the Trinitarians considered them heretics (and vice-versa). Nor would the Credo test pass Nestorians or Monophysites.

EDIT: forgot to point out the irony: The Ethiopian Church is monophysite.

[Primula Baggins]

Thanks for some fun Wikipedia time, soli.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

Going back for a moment.

I think there is some Hinduism in there?

I have never heard that there is any Hindu influence on Rastafarians. Can you elaborate?

[nerdanel]

Just from Googling - this page has a discussion of Hinduism's influence on Rastafarians: http://debate.uvm.edu/dreadlibrary/david.html

[Voronwë the Faithful]

Thanks, nel. Interesting.

[Inanna]

I didn't know Hinduism was so big on marijuana. Seems like I haven't been following my faith.

[rwhen]

Yeah, it does get a bit messy. Belief-wise, Christians must believe that God is Trinity and that Jesus (who is God and Man) accomplished our salvation by his life, death and resurrection (in a nutshell). If a person cannot recite the Apostles' Creed without redefining words, they probably have non-Christian beliefs.....snip

Mith, it might be a bit more accurate to put "Catholic/Protestant/Lutheran type Christians....then what you said. There are other long established Christian religions that do not subscribe to the Trinity docterine.

Mormans, Jehovah's Witnesses to name two and they certainly consider themselves Christians, meaning "believing in Christ". But not the trinity.

Just as a point of view. There are many that do believe that one can be a Christian and not an adherant of the trinity.

Oh and on track. I think that the Rasta's DO think they have some aspect of Christian beliefs as a basis for their own religion. What I have understood has already been illuminated here.