New Fashion Statement in Iran

The place for measured discourse about politics and current events, including developments in science and medicine.
User avatar
Whistler
Posts: 2865
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 2:34 pm
Contact:

New Fashion Statement in Iran

Post by Whistler »

Usually we disapprove of cut-and-paste threads around here, but sometimes something comes along that really does need to be seen by everybody. And while we usually request that thread-starters offer some commentary on whatever they're posting, there will sometimes be a case in which commentary is almost beside the point. From canada.com, May 19:
Human rights groups are raising alarms over a new law passed by the Iranian parliament that would require the country's Jews and Christians to wear coloured badges to identify them and other religious minorities as non-Muslims.

"This is reminiscent of the Holocaust," said Rabbi Marvin Hier, the dean of the Simon Wiesenthal Center in Los Angeles. "Iran is moving closer and closer to the ideology of the Nazis."

Iranian expatriates living in Canada yesterday confirmed reports that the Iranian parliament, called the Islamic Majlis, passed a law this week setting a dress code for all Iranians, requiring them to wear almost identical "standard Islamic garments."

The law, which must still be approved by Iran's "Supreme Guide" Ali Khamenehi before being put into effect, also establishes special insignia to be worn by non-Muslims.

Iran's roughly 25,000 Jews would have to sew a yellow strip of cloth on the front of their clothes, while Christians would wear red badges and Zoroastrians would be forced to wear blue cloth.

"There's no reason to believe they won't pass this," said Rabbi Hier. "It will certainly pass unless there's some sort of international outcry over this."

Bernie Farber, the chief executive of the Canadian Jewish Congress, said he was "stunned" by the measure. "We thought this had gone the way of the dodo bird, but clearly in Iran everything old and bad is new again," he said. "It's state-sponsored religious discrimination."

Ali Behroozian, an Iranian exile living in Toronto, said the law could come into force as early as next year.

It would make religious minorities immediately identifiable and allow Muslims to avoid contact with non-Muslims.

Mr. Behroozian said it will make life even more difficult for Iran's small pockets of Jewish, Christian and other religious minorities -- the country is overwhelmingly Shi'ite Muslim. "They have all been persecuted for a while, but these new dress rules are going to make things worse for them," he said.

The new law was drafted two years ago, but was stuck in the Iranian parliament until recently when it was revived at the behest of President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad.

A spokesman for the Iranian Embassy in Ottawa refused to comment on the measures. "This is nothing to do with anything here," said a press secretary who identified himself as Mr. Gharmani.

"We are not here to answer such questions."

The Simon Wiesenthal Centre has written to Kofi Annan, the Secretary-General of the United Nations, protesting the Iranian law and calling on the international community to bring pressure on Iran to drop the measure.

"The world should not ignore this," said Rabbi Hier. "The world ignored Hitler for many years -- he was dismissed as a demagogue, they said he'd never come to power -- and we were all wrong."

Mr. Farber said Canada and other nations should take action to isolate Mr. Ahmadinejad in light of the new law, which he called "chilling," and his previous string of anti-Semitic statements.

"There are some very frightening parallels here," he said. "It's time to start considering how we're going to deal with this person."

Mr. Ahmadinejad has repeatedly described the Holocaust as a myth and earlier this year announced Iran would host a conference to re-examine the history of the Nazis' "Final Solution."

He has caused international outrage by publicly calling for Israel to be "wiped off the map."

Iran does not yet have nuclear weapons, but Tehran believed by Western nations to be developing its own nuclear military capability, in defiance of international protocols and peace treaties.

The United States, France and Israel accuse Iran of using a civilian nuclear program to secretly build a weapon. Iran denies this, saying its program is confined to generating electricity.

cwattie@nationalpost.com
User avatar
yovargas
I miss Prim ...
Posts: 15011
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2005 12:13 am
Location: Florida

Post by yovargas »

:cry:
I wanna love somebody but I don't know how
I wanna throw my body in the river and drown
-The Decemberists


Image
User avatar
Alatar
of Vinyamar
Posts: 10603
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:39 pm
Location: Ireland
Contact:

Post by Alatar »

Frightening.
Image
The Vinyamars on Stage! This time at Bag End
User avatar
Whistler
Posts: 2865
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 2:34 pm
Contact:

Post by Whistler »

As I recall, Yov, homosexuals wore pink triangles in Nazi Germany. Though I suspect Iran will skip the gay badge and go straight to execution.
User avatar
vison
Best friends forever
Posts: 11961
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:33 pm
Location: Over there.

Post by vison »

:(

There's a lot a person could say. But right now all I can be is discouraged and sad.
Dig deeper.
User avatar
JewelSong
Just Keep Singin'
Posts: 4660
Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2005 1:35 am
Location: Boston, MA
Contact:

Post by JewelSong »

Damn.

Just...damn.
"Live! Live! Live! Life is a banquet, and most poor suckers are starving to death!" - Auntie Mame

Image
User avatar
Pearly Di
Elvendork
Posts: 1751
Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2005 1:46 pm
Location: The Shire

Post by Pearly Di »

:x :x :x :x :x :x :x :x :x


This makes me so very angry.

This man is an evil clown. But unfortunately the problem is not just him: it's the whole bunch of religious despots who want to rule that country with a rod of iron.

I want to stand in solidarity with Iran's religious minorities and their hard-pressed democracy movement.
Last edited by Pearly Di on Fri May 19, 2006 3:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Frodo undertook his quest out of love - to save the world he knew from disaster at his own expense, if he could ... "
Letter no. 246, The Collected Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien
Avatar by goldlighticons on Live Journal
User avatar
yovargas
I miss Prim ...
Posts: 15011
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2005 12:13 am
Location: Florida

Post by yovargas »

I was tearing up reading that article...
Whistler wrote:As I recall, Yov, homosexuals wore pink triangles in Nazi Germany. Though I suspect Iran will skip the gay badge and go straight to execution.
Yeah. Gays took the sign back with pride though.
I wanna love somebody but I don't know how
I wanna throw my body in the river and drown
-The Decemberists


Image
User avatar
Voronwë the Faithful
At the intersection of here and now
Posts: 46192
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:41 am
Contact:

Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

:cry:
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
User avatar
Whistler
Posts: 2865
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 2:34 pm
Contact:

Post by Whistler »

Well, at least we can take comfort in the fact that their nuclear program is for peaceful purposes.
User avatar
JewelSong
Just Keep Singin'
Posts: 4660
Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2005 1:35 am
Location: Boston, MA
Contact:

Post by JewelSong »

Are there any Muslims protesting against this, I wonder?
"Live! Live! Live! Life is a banquet, and most poor suckers are starving to death!" - Auntie Mame

Image
User avatar
Whistler
Posts: 2865
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 2:34 pm
Contact:

Post by Whistler »

JewelSong wrote:Are there any Muslims protesting against this, I wonder?
That's always the question I ask at such times.

The silence is usually deafening.
halplm
hooked
Posts: 4864
Joined: Sat Dec 03, 2005 7:15 am

Post by halplm »

It's not really surprising... it's the natural progression when you teach hate. :cry:
For the TROUBLED may you find PEACE
For the DESPAIRING may you find HOPE
For the LONELY may you find LOVE
For the SKEPTICAL may you find FAITH
-Frances C. Arrillaga 1941-1995
User avatar
truehobbit
Cute, cuddly and dangerous to know
Posts: 6019
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 2:52 am
Contact:

Post by truehobbit »

Yikes!

Although I must say I haven't heard about this from any other source. Not that I'm the keenest follower of news, but wouldn't this have caused a world-wide outcry?

The attached statement about Iran's nuclear program makes me suspicious, I must say. What if the article is just an attempt to sway opinions for the West taking steps against the nuclear program.
I mean, if they are that evil...
but being a cheerful hobbit he had not needed hope, as long as despair could be postponed.
nerdanel
This is Rome
Posts: 5963
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:48 pm
Location: Concrete Jungle by the Lagoon

Post by nerdanel »

Whistler, I'm not sure if you were aware, but Iran has been perpetrating an "off with your heads" sort of fashion statement against gay individuals for a good while now. I remember posting about this elsewhere last summer, outraged. Today's source of outrage - in Googling to find those articles to post them in this thread, this seems primarily to have received coverage from the gay media (and, of course, Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch) - when it should be a source of international outrage to all.

So although I share everyone here's outrage at what is likely to be done to that country's religious minorities, I feel the need to point out that Iran has actually been jailing and murdering members of another minority group fon an ongoing basis...which is a bit more than a fashion statement, however vile and outrageous.
Report: Iran Gay Teens Executed
by 365Gay.com Newscenter Staff

Posted: July 21, 2005 11:00 am ET

(London) Two teenagers have been executed after a religious court found them them guilty of homosexuality according to pro-Democracy groups.

The Iranian Students News Agency reports that the executions took place on July 19 in the northeastern city of Mashhad.

One teen, ISNA says was 18, the other was a minor, believed to be 16 or 17. The organization ran a picture of what it said was the execution on its Web site.

The English language Iran In Focus also reported the executions, saying the teens were hanged in public in the city square. It quotes sources as saying the teens were executed for having sex with another minor but this could not be confirmed. The report does not name the victim. Under Sharia law the victim of a sexual assault must also be executed.

Both news services say that prior to their execution, the teenagers were held in prison for 14 months, severely beaten and given the lash 228 times.

A report of the executions was also carried on the website of the respected democratic opposition movement, The National Council of Resistance Of Iran.

Ruhollah Rezazadeh, the lawyer for the younger teen reportedly had appealed the death sentence but the Supreme Court in Tehran ordered him to be hanged.

Under the Iranian penal code, girls as young as nine and boys as young as 15 can be hanged.

Three other young gay Iranians are reportedly being hunted by police, but they are said to have gone into hiding and cannot be found. If caught, they would also face execution.

The British LGBT rights group OutRage has called for sanctions against Iran. The organization has called for western states to break off diplomatic relations, impose trade sanctions and treat Iran as "a pariah state".

"This is just the latest barbarity by the Islamo-fascists in Iran,” said OutRage spokesperson Peter Tatchell.

"The entire country is a gigantic prison, with Islamic rule sustained by detention without trial, torture and state-sanctioned murder.

"According to Iranian human rights campaigners, over 4,000 lesbians and gay men have been executed since the Ayatollahs seized power in 1979," said Tatchell.

Iran In Focus reports that members of Iran’s parliament are applauding the court for carrying out the death sentence on the teens.

"These individuals were corrupt. Their sentence was carried out with the approval of the judiciary and it served them right,” the publication quotes Ali Asgari, a member of the Majlis Party Legal Affairs Committee.

At least three men have been sentenced over the past month to death by stoning in Nigeria which also follows Sharia law in several provinces.
In March a gay couple was beheaded in a public execution in Saudi Arabia. The pair had been convicted of killing a blackmailer who had threatened to expose them to authorities. Hundreds of other gays have been rounded up by Saudi authorities in recent months.
Wikipedia wrote: Since the 1979 Iranian revolution, the legal code has been based on a conservative interpretation of Islamic Shari'a law. All sexual relations that occur outside of a traditional, heterosexual marriage (i.e. sodomy, or adultery) are illegal and no legal distinction is made between consensual or non-consensual sexual activity. Homosexual relations that occur between consenting adults in private are a crime and carry a maximum punishment of death, with teenage boys as young as fifteen being eligible for the death penalty (Mahmoud Asgari and Ayaz Marhoni). Approved by the Islamic Republic Parliament on 30/7/1991 and finally ratified by the High Expediency Council on 28/11/1991 articles 108 through 140 distinctly talk about homosexuality and its punishments in details [6]:

Male Homosexuality: Sodomy is a crime, for which both partners are punished. The punishment is death if the participants are adults, of sound mind and consenting; the method of execution is for the Shari'a judge to decide. A non-adult who engages in consensual sodomy is subject to a punishment of 74 lashes. (Articles 108 to 113) Sodomy is proved either if a person confesses four times to having committed sodomy or by the testimony of four righteous men. Testimony of women alone or together with a man does not prove sodomy. (Articles 114 to 119). "Tafhiz" (the rubbing of the thighs or buttocks) and the like committed by two men is punished by 100 lashes. On the fourth occasion, the punishment is death. (Articles 121 and 122). If two men "stand naked under one cover without any necessity", both are punished with up to 99 lashes; if a man "kisses another with lust" the punishment is 60 lashes. (Articles 123 and 124). If sodomy, or the lesser crimes referred to above, are proved by confession, and the person concerned repents, the Shari'a judge may request that he be pardoned. If a person who has committed the lesser crimes referred to above repents before the giving of testimony by the witnesses, the punishment is quashed. (Articles 125 and 126).

Female Homosexuality: The punishment for female homosexuality involving persons who are mature, of sound mind, and consenting, is 100 lashes. If the act is repeated three times and punishment is enforced each time, the death sentence will apply on the fourth occasion. (Articles 127, 129, 130) The ways of proving lesbianism in court are the same as for male homosexuality. (Article 128) Non-Moslem and Moslem alike are subject to punishment (Article 130) The rules for the quashing of sentences, or for pardoning, are the same as for the lesser male homosexual offences (Articles 132 and 133) Women who "stand naked under one cover without necessity" and are not relatives are punished by up to 100 lashes. (Article 134)
Wikipedia wrote:There are various reports of the death penalty being applied for homosexual conduct, and as this sentence has often been carried out against dissidents it may be a tool to silent political dissent as much as to oppress homosexuals.

According to The Boroumand Foundation there are records of at least 107 executions with charges related to homosexuality between 1979 and 1990.[7]

According to Amnesty International, at least 5 homosexuals, three gay men and two lesbians were executed in January 1990, as a result of the Iranian government's policy of calling for the execution of homosexuals. They were publicly beheaded.[8]

In April 1992, Dr. Ali Mozafarian, a Sunni Muslim leader in the Fars province (Southern Iran), was executed in Shiraz, convicted on charges of espionage, adultery and sodomy. His videotaped confession was broadcast on television in Shiraz and in the streets of Kazerun and Lar.

On March, 14 1994 dissident writer Ali Akbar Saidi Sirjani was charged with offences ranging from espionage to homosexual improprieties.

On November, 12 1995, by the verdict of the eighth judicial branch of Hamadan, and the confirmation of the Supreme Court of Iran, Mehdi Barazandeh, otherwise known as Safa Ali Shah Hamadani, was condemned to death. The judicial authorities announced that Barazandeh's crimes were repeated acts of adultery and "the obscene act of sodomy". The court's decree was carried out by stoning Barazandeh. Barazandeh belonged to the Khaksarieh Sect of Dervishes. (Islamic Republic Newspaper - November 14th 1995 + reported in Homan's magazine June, 10 1996).

Iranian youths Mahmoud Asgari and Ayaz Marhoni executed in 2005 reportedly due to the abduction and rape of a minor. In response to criticism from international human rights groups, the government stated that two youth were killed for kidnapping and rape, not homosexuality, although several domestic progressive groups doubt the official government position.In 2005, two Iranian teenagers, Mahmoud Asgari and Ayaz Marhoni, were both sentenced to death for what some human rights groups claimed was "consensual gay sex" while Iranian authorities asserted that the two were part of a criminal gang that raped a thirteen year old boy. Again, the government claims were disputed by international organizations and progressive domestic groups [9].

At the discretion of the Iranian court, fines, prison sentences and public lashing may be used instead of a public execution. As the Islamic law covers all aspects of Iranian society and culture, no public discussion of homosexuality is permitted, no gay rights organizations are allowed to exist and no political party that supports gay rights will have their candidates on the election ballot.
I won't just survive
Oh, you will see me thrive
Can't write my story
I'm beyond the archetype
I won't just conform
No matter how you shake my core
'Cause my roots, they run deep, oh

When, when the fire's at my feet again
And the vultures all start circling
They're whispering, "You're out of time,"
But still I rise
This is no mistake, no accident
When you think the final nail is in, think again
Don't be surprised, I will still rise
User avatar
Whistler
Posts: 2865
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 2:34 pm
Contact:

Post by Whistler »

I was aware that in Afghanistan the Taliban liked to drop walls (!?) on homosexuals in a large open-air theatre for the entertainment of cheering audiences. I wasn't aware that Iran had similar customs, but it's hardly surprising.

Did you know that in Iran dogs are considered demons, and that there are government officials whose job is to shoot them on sight? Obviously this is nothing compared to the unimaginable abuses against humans, but it provides a good illustration of the weirdly medieval mindset we're dealing with.
nerdanel
This is Rome
Posts: 5963
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:48 pm
Location: Concrete Jungle by the Lagoon

Post by nerdanel »

And so we see it - what 21st century life looks like when a state attempts to criminalize (or, thus far in the case of religion, grossly stigmatize) volitional conduct pursuant to informed adult choice.

Legislation of morality is an exceedingly messy business, whether one legislates acceptable forms of sexual expression between consenting adults, or legislates acceptable forms of religious expression for those same adults. It's interesting that the instant we discuss a country that is trying both, we think to Nazi Germany. Of course, we had the former in this country, in less extreme form, until the "judicial activism" of "liberal elitist judges" brought America into the 21st century a mere three years ago.

I agree with JS' question, but would just remind that Muslims may not be free to protest in all countries. Freedom of speech seems rarer than the most precious of metals in parts of the Islamic world - and while taking to the streets to protest Western cartoons may be sanctioned by TPTB, protesting legislation passed by an Islamic government seems less likely to be similarly permitted. Of course, that does not apply to the Muslims (and, actually, the rest of us) in most countries not governed by Islamic law.

Lastly, I'd like to note that I wish we had liberal Muslim members to participate in these discussions (and those in the TE forum). It troubles me that non-extremist Muslim perspectives seem so rare in these discussions, no matter where they take place, and I would very much value hearing from people who practice that religion, but do not subscribe to the more...extreme and offensive manifestations that seem to develop in the Middle East.
I won't just survive
Oh, you will see me thrive
Can't write my story
I'm beyond the archetype
I won't just conform
No matter how you shake my core
'Cause my roots, they run deep, oh

When, when the fire's at my feet again
And the vultures all start circling
They're whispering, "You're out of time,"
But still I rise
This is no mistake, no accident
When you think the final nail is in, think again
Don't be surprised, I will still rise
User avatar
Whistler
Posts: 2865
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 2:34 pm
Contact:

Post by Whistler »

I believe there are a couple of Muslims at B77, but they haven't ventured over here yet. I wouldn't mind extending an invitation, but it would sound like (and probably would be) tokenism, and would also smack of "setting a trap." So we'll just have to wonder what they think.
Erunáme
Posts: 2364
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:54 pm
Contact:

Post by Erunáme »

Unbelievable.
Under Sharia law the victim of a sexual assault must also be executed.
:shock: :x
User avatar
The Watcher
Posts: 563
Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2005 12:04 am
Location: southeastern Wisconsin

Post by The Watcher »

Whistler -

Instead of playing on the ideas of the sympathetic ears (i.e. the huge numbers of Muslims who value their own religion but do not wish to see it applied to others who disagree) why not instead try a different tack?

The West, and not just America, has been basically equating the extremists within the Islamic faith with the nutcases and power zealots determined to "stand against the West "(and whoever else falls within their condemnation rage range.) But, we have not ever TRIED to embrace the rest of that vast population with sympathy and understanding. Yes, most of these people come from backgrounds that are very different from ours, but that is not to say that they do not all desire the same ultimate goals.

Except for the disenfranchised, powerless, and on the other end of the extreme, the power zealots, the control freaks, the religiously fervored retaliationsist, Islam is reallly getting nailed for the most part. Of course, the more moderates and even liberals shut up - why would they want to speak out in this climate?

I offer the following: We treat the faith with respect, we encourage the more moderate and even liberal? elements to speak out, and the West as a whole publishes this and broadcasts it from every corner. We point out why democracy and personal freedoms are advantageous, but we also encourage following these basic principles as a way out of medieval attitudes. Heck, it worked in India, Japan, Malaysia, and many other parts of the world, it certainly worked with the former USSR and its puppets for the most part. Nothing is perfect, but those places have basically embraced a great deal of wanting to be modern and in so doing, the old despotic highly regulated aspects of those governments failed, or are failing.

What we are condemning here is a despotic regime, not the people trapped within it. Does anyone seriously here believe that the majority of Iranians are comfortable with what they have? Make them realize they are backwards and stagnant as a society, that their political leaders are not leading them into a "holy war of faith" but a brutal repressive dictatorship. And the same goes for the rest of the Middle East. Saudi Arabia and many other countries are as equally repressive. I do not see the condemnations going to those countries, many who are equally as deserving of it.

The best thing the "West" can do? Stop needing the oil and gas that is this area's only contribution to the world economy. As soon as the world can wean itself off of this and state that their (the ME) sole contribution in commodities is not highly prized, the better. I know myself that this premature and highly idealistic thinking, but it is the truth. These countries get away with their atrocities because they still know that we want is their fuel reserves. We overlook quite a bit to obtain that.

It makes for a most awkward and totally futile type of arrangement.
Last edited by The Watcher on Fri May 19, 2006 8:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Post Reply