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PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2016 11:31 pm 
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I had fun going to Wikipedia ("List of people on United States banknotes"). It was surprising.

People who are on or have been on U.S. paper currency but are neither Founders nor presidents include:

    Sen. Thomas Hart Benton
    Chief Justice Salmon Portland Chase
    Meriwether Lewis (explorer)
    William Clark (explorer)
    Henry Clay
    DeWitt Clinton
    Sen. Edward Everett
    Admiral David Farragut
    Robert Fulton (inventor of the steam engine)
    Gen. Winfield Scott Hancock
    John Jay Knox
    William Learned Marcy
    Maj. Gen. James Birdseye McPherson
    Maj. Gen. George Gordon Meade
    Samuel Morse (inventor of the telegraph)
    Running Antelope (Sioux Chief of the Hunkpapa)
    William Henry Seward (bought Alaska)
    Gen. Philip Henry Sheridan
    Gen. William Tecumseh Sherman
    Sen. Charles Sumner
    Martha Washington
    Daniel Webster

Not sure Harriet Tubman doesn't equal any of these.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 12:09 am 
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Ah, well, point taken.
(Which ones of those are current? Very few of those people even sound familiar.)

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 12:13 am 
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Primula Baggins wrote:
That's pretty negative, Voronwë. I think we have better representatives in our history; and in any case, isn't honoring people in this public, national way necessarily aspirational? Not, this is who we are, but, this is who we admire and respect—examples for our kids?


Ah, but since I think that money is an evil invention, having an evil person on its face is probably more representative than having a good one.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 12:32 am 
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yovargas wrote:
Ah, well, point taken.
(Which ones of those are current? Very few of those people even sound familiar.)

None of them are on currency that is currently being printed. Some were on obscure bills, or on common ones a long time ago. I just was surprised at how far the list did go beyond presidents and signers of the Declaration.

It didn't go very much at all beyond white men, of course—one white person who was not a man, and one man who was not a white person.
Voronwë the Faithful wrote:
Primula Baggins wrote:
That's pretty negative, Voronwë. I think we have better representatives in our history; and in any case, isn't honoring people in this public, national way necessarily aspirational? Not, this is who we are, but, this is who we admire and respect—examples for our kids?

Ah, but since I think that money is an evil invention, having an evil person on its face is probably more representative than having a good one.

A matter of perspective, then! Got to respect that. :D

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― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 2:34 am 
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You've got to start somewhere. The theme has been "rich older white guys" for over two hundred years now in this country. I'm all good with a new theme for a new millennium.

Now I'm wondering. Obviously European countries had much more time for history to happen, but has any of them stuck to all-male rulers/leaders this far? England had the two Elisabeths, Victoria, among others. Russia had the two Ekaterinas (and a few others). Spain, Isabella (aafo). Mary, Queen of Scots, obvs. Um... off to Google.

Sweden, I just found out, had Christina crowned as King of Swedes, Goths and Vandals. Georgia's Tamar was also crowned King, as were Anna and Hedwig of Poland. France has gone with the Salic law, so no ruling queens, but they had a few regents. A few queens in parts of Italy. Pretty much everywhere, actually.

Not going to start looking for elected leaders now.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 7:50 am 
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Well, speaking as a non-American, I have no idea who Tubman is. My kids thought Rosa Parks would have been a better choice, and I can't say I disagree. You want a woman who changed the face of America? There you go.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 7:57 am 
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There was a major push to make Australian currency representative about twenty years ago, and we currently have (by design) equal numbers of men and women, with one of the men being Aboriginal and another of German-Jewish background. It does mean that some quite obscure people are on the currency - I only actually learned who the woman on the $20 bill is when I looked it up about thirty seconds ago - but they are also fairly non-controversial. Except for the Queen, I suppose, who republicans would like to see removed from the $5 bill.

The Canadians use the Queen and a series of Prime Ministers, but I understand they may be planning to change that.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 9:05 am 
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The last proper Irish currency (Pre-Euro) was populated by characters from Literature and the Arts. I approve of this!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Series_B_Banknotes

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 9:13 am 
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Alatar wrote:
Well, speaking as a non-American, I have no idea who Tubman is. My kids thought Rosa Parks would have been a better choice, and I can't say I disagree. You want a woman who changed the face of America? There you go.


The US does have more than sixty years of history, though. ;) Possibly there was the desire of staying in roughly the same historical zone.

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‘There’s no greys, only white that’s got grubby. I’m surprised you don’t know that. And sin, young man, is when you treat people as things. Including yourself. That’s what sin is.’
‘It’s a lot more complicated than that -’
‘No. It ain’t. When people say things are a lot more complicated than that, they means they’re getting worried that they won’t like the truth. People as things, that’s where it starts.’
Terry Pratchett, Carpe Jugulum


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 12:24 pm 
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Tubman spent most of her life actively fighting slavery in ways that could have gotten her killed had she been caught, and served as a spy during the Civil War on top of that. In later life, she campaigned for women's suffrage. Parks refused to stand up that one time. And only achieved fame for it because she was more media friendly than the numerous other black men and women who did the same thing at the same time. Tubman is a much better choice, IMO. If Parks is more familiar, all the more reason to give Tubman some more exposure! :)


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 1:04 pm 
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India has only Gandhi on ALL the bills.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 1:47 pm 
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Switzerland is currently also introducing a new line of banknotes. It's the second time since I live here (1988). All banknotes are redesigned. They are very pretty, imho. Political figures were never chosen for banknotes, but artists or landscapes or symbolic scenes. At the last change, a 200 francs not was created, so it is possible to make banknotes with new amounts.
More on Swiss banknotes:
https://www.snb.ch/en/iabout/cash/histo ... y_overview

Germany also did not use political figures after WWII. Eastern German money had Karl Marx on it...

In Switzerland, banknotes are still very popular and it holds the banknote with the second highest value worldwide (1000 francs - almost the same amount in dollars). Now, with negative interest in many Swiss banks, they are very, very popular. It has become more profitable just to keep a 1000 francs note at home for a few years than to put it on a bank account and get no or 0.5% or even negative interest...

I used to love the French 50 francs note with Saint-Exupéry and the little Prince on the back side, before the Euro was introduced.
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Money, as stamps are powerful propaganda vehicles. It would be an interesting research subject for a phD.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 1:48 pm 
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Alatar wrote:
The last proper Irish currency (Pre-Euro) was populated by characters from Literature and the Arts. I approve of this!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Series_B_Banknotes


I like that idea, but for U.S. currency, I think the best choices would be Looney Tune cartoon characters.

(Cross-posted with Nin!)

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 2:38 pm 
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I agree with Dave's assessment. Tubman laid everything on the line. Parks is admirable, but her fame stems from doing the right thing at the right moment to catch national attention, when (as Dave says) many others were doing the same outside the spotlight. Here's Wikipedia's synopsis of what Tubman did:
Quote:
Harriet Tubman (born Araminta Ross; c. 1822[1] – March 10, 1913) was an American abolitionist, humanitarian, and an armed scout and spy for the United States Army during the American Civil War. Born into slavery, Tubman escaped and subsequently made some thirteen missions to rescue approximately seventy enslaved families and friends,[2] using the network of antislavery activists and safe houses known as the Underground Railroad. She later helped abolitionist John Brown recruit men for his raid on Harpers Ferry, and in the post-war era was an active participant in the struggle for women's suffrage.

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“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 2:49 pm 
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It would've been cooler if they just did a full redesign with great non-political figures and all the notes. I could definitely get behind that idea.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 2:49 pm 
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Yeah, I get that, but people are remembered for moments. This feels like "Look, you SHOULD remember this person, even if you don't".

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 2:51 pm 
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To be fair, Tubman may not be as famous as Parks, but in the US at least, she's still pretty darn famous. Certainly famous enough to merit the honor.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 3:13 pm 
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Voronwë the Faithful wrote:
Ah, but since I think that money is an evil invention, having an evil person on its face is probably more representative than having a good one.


Barter is so cumbersome.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 3:16 pm 
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Yeah, I get that, but people are remembered for moments. This feels like "Look, you SHOULD remember this person, even if you don't".

I studied Tubman's life in history class more than 40 years ago. I was in a pretty conservative district, too.

And I'm not sure people should be remembered for moments, or only that, however noble that in-the-moment act may have been. We can learn more from people who lived whole lives and made real sacrifices in the fight for a good cause. Gandhi's on all the money for a reason.

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“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 3:20 pm 
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I get that but... what I'm trying to say is, you don;t get to tell people whats memorable. It just kinda... is.

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