Riots in Tunisia (and throughout the Middle-East)
Riots in Tunisia (and throughout the Middle-East)
Since several days now, the country of Tunisia has seen a series of riots in various citites, which have now reached the capital Tunis. There have already been several victims of the voilences surrounding the riots.
In comparison to many other arab countries, Tunisia has been rather quite since its independance, developping tourism and a very moderate islam - always in comparison to other arab countries.
I was surprised to see no thread about this subject. There are many reasons for those riots, many of them are economic (unemployment among young academics is very high), some are politic - although in theory a democracy, Tunisia has the same president since 1987.
Yet, the risk of escalation of those riots does exist und with that certainly the risk of more radical islamists gaining more power - and I'd be curious to know, how you think about it.
Or maybe this rather quiet and small country does simply not exist on the political horizon of other countries where French is not spoken? Here, reports in the media are quite detailled, as today a French and Swiss woman were killed and as French is spoken in Tunisia - the "francophonie" does stick together in moments like this.
To give you some more information and some images: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-12180738
http://edition.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/afric ... index.html
In comparison to many other arab countries, Tunisia has been rather quite since its independance, developping tourism and a very moderate islam - always in comparison to other arab countries.
I was surprised to see no thread about this subject. There are many reasons for those riots, many of them are economic (unemployment among young academics is very high), some are politic - although in theory a democracy, Tunisia has the same president since 1987.
Yet, the risk of escalation of those riots does exist und with that certainly the risk of more radical islamists gaining more power - and I'd be curious to know, how you think about it.
Or maybe this rather quiet and small country does simply not exist on the political horizon of other countries where French is not spoken? Here, reports in the media are quite detailled, as today a French and Swiss woman were killed and as French is spoken in Tunisia - the "francophonie" does stick together in moments like this.
To give you some more information and some images: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-12180738
http://edition.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/afric ... index.html
Last edited by Nin on Thu Jan 13, 2011 6:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"nolite te bastardes carborundorum".
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Thank you for those links, Nin.
The BBC story says that one possible contributing factor to the riots was the Wikileaks cables that contain frank assessments of the level of corruption and the Tunisian government's lack of interest in reforms. (Here's an interesting and detailed one.)
But the level of violence is shocking, with innocent people killed, and evidently no consistent policy for dealing with the situation. The president's son-in-law has reportedly fled to his mansion in Canada, evidently unsure it's going to come out well for the existing power structure.
I hope this will become more prominent in U.S. news as the Tucson shooting recedes from the top of all reports.
The BBC story says that one possible contributing factor to the riots was the Wikileaks cables that contain frank assessments of the level of corruption and the Tunisian government's lack of interest in reforms. (Here's an interesting and detailed one.)
But the level of violence is shocking, with innocent people killed, and evidently no consistent policy for dealing with the situation. The president's son-in-law has reportedly fled to his mansion in Canada, evidently unsure it's going to come out well for the existing power structure.
I hope this will become more prominent in U.S. news as the Tucson shooting recedes from the top of all reports.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
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Re: Riots in Tunesia
This is the first and only place I've heard about it.Nin wrote:Or maybe this rather quiet and small country does simply not exist on the political horizon of other countries where French is not spoken?
Well, here the media report a lot about those riots which are emblematic for the crisis of the moderate Arabic states, like Egypt,Marocco, Algeria or Syria, in a lesser way Lybia.
Most of those countries have at least some oil, but despite that the population is growing poorer and there are no jobs for young people - especially not for young academics as the industry settled is often tourism or textile industry, so little technology value added industry.
Those are young countries: in Tunisia 2/3 of the population are under 30. But they are ruled by old men - and many of them since long years. Tunesia since 1987, Egypt has the same president since 30 years... democracy is not really existing and none of those countries, however rich are those who have oil, have succeeded in creating any stable form of social security. Many young people have no perspective and the political situation is seen as stagnation.
During the last weeks, major problems have occured in Egypt with violence against the Christian minority of Copts (do you say so in english?) Lebanon seems on the edge of another civil war. And the list goes on...
Today, Hillary Clinton intervened.
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld ... 9066.story
In the past, those not very democratic - but very stable - political regimes have all had US support, being seen as guarantees of stability against islamism. When I see those riots, I fear that the contrary could be happening: the rise of a more radical islamist gouvernement which is at least promising to people what they want most: change.
Most of those countries have at least some oil, but despite that the population is growing poorer and there are no jobs for young people - especially not for young academics as the industry settled is often tourism or textile industry, so little technology value added industry.
Those are young countries: in Tunisia 2/3 of the population are under 30. But they are ruled by old men - and many of them since long years. Tunesia since 1987, Egypt has the same president since 30 years... democracy is not really existing and none of those countries, however rich are those who have oil, have succeeded in creating any stable form of social security. Many young people have no perspective and the political situation is seen as stagnation.
During the last weeks, major problems have occured in Egypt with violence against the Christian minority of Copts (do you say so in english?) Lebanon seems on the edge of another civil war. And the list goes on...
Today, Hillary Clinton intervened.
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld ... 9066.story
In the past, those not very democratic - but very stable - political regimes have all had US support, being seen as guarantees of stability against islamism. When I see those riots, I fear that the contrary could be happening: the rise of a more radical islamist gouvernement which is at least promising to people what they want most: change.
"nolite te bastardes carborundorum".
I heard a blurb about the situation in Egypt. Here we say "Coptic Christians."Nin wrote: During the last weeks, major problems have occured in Egypt with violence against the Christian minority of Copts (do you say so in english?) Lebanon seems on the edge of another civil war. And the list goes on...
As for Tunisia, like Dave_LF, this is the first place I've heard anything about it. Presently the media here are focused on another French speaking nation, Haiti; yesterday was the 1 year anniversary of the earthquake. (Conditions remain very poor while rioting, though isolated, is on the rise.) And Tuscon for obvious reasons.
Thank you for the update.
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The situation with Coptic Christians did get some coverage because of the stories of crowds of Muslims gathering outside their churches to protect them during their Christmas services.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
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Just now, from BBC News: Tunisia President Ben Ali 'will not seek new term'
Of course, as he said this, troops were firing live rounds at protesters.Tunisia's president has said he will not seek a new term in office in 2014, following widespread protests which have left at least 23 people dead.
Zine al-Abidine Ben Ali also said he was also ordering police to stop using live fire against protesters.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
And he is 74 years old... so it is not a very convincing gesture.
When I open my newspaper today, on the first pages are articles about Tunisia, about Tusco and Palin's reaction (with a translation of a part of her intervention), about the crisis in Lebanon, the € crisis and the organ traffic in Kosovo...
There has been a lot of coverage of Tusco and the anniversary of the earthquake, but Tunisia is on the front page since two days. Today, a Swiss bi-national woman was killed, that's of course part of the reason.
I still have to read today's in depth analysis, but can gladly report.
Were other international crisis, like Ivory coast, reported in the US?
When I open my newspaper today, on the first pages are articles about Tunisia, about Tusco and Palin's reaction (with a translation of a part of her intervention), about the crisis in Lebanon, the € crisis and the organ traffic in Kosovo...
There has been a lot of coverage of Tusco and the anniversary of the earthquake, but Tunisia is on the front page since two days. Today, a Swiss bi-national woman was killed, that's of course part of the reason.
I still have to read today's in depth analysis, but can gladly report.
Were other international crisis, like Ivory coast, reported in the US?
"nolite te bastardes carborundorum".
I did quite a lot of research into the Mahgred to test it as a viable market, and had I stayed in that role probably would have tried to do some more business there. The bulk of the u work was for Libya, but looking at the area, there were a good number of countries which were viable, including Tunisia, however against the fact that a good number of these countries were stable, relatively rich and reasonably well disposed towards the west, there were a couple of political problems affecting every country in the region, firstly the so called democratice govts were very factionalised and unfrt the main man the competing factions were very divisive and encouraged endemic corruption. Secondly there are large groups of dissafected people, and whislt militant Islam may not be a natural home for them. nonetheless it does offer to fulfill their aspirations.
Since 1410 most Welsh people most of the time have abandoned any idea of independence as unthinkable. But since 1410 most Welsh people, at some time or another, if only in some secret corner of the mind, have been "out with Owain and his barefoot scrubs." For the Welsh mind is still haunted by it's lightning-flash vision of a people that was free.
Gwyn A. Williams,
Gwyn A. Williams,
- Primula Baggins
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There has been U.S. coverage of the situation in Ivory Coast, Nin.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
- BrianIsSmilingAtYou
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The riots in Tunisia are on the main page of the NY Times online:
I've linked to the article below:
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/14/world ... ia.html?hp
BrianIs AtYou
I've linked to the article below:
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/14/world ... ia.html?hp
BrianIs AtYou
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- Primula Baggins
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Here's an article in today's New York Times:
Behind Tunisia Unrest, Rage Over Wealth of Ruling Family.
Behind Tunisia Unrest, Rage Over Wealth of Ruling Family.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
On its front page, CNN reports that Tunisia's prime minister, Mohamed Ghannouchi, has taken over as an interim president. Mention is made of media reports stating that President Ben Ali left the country.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/africa/01 ... 1&iref=BN1
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/africa/01 ... 1&iref=BN1
It certainly seems that way...vison wrote:This is the future. We better get used to it.
A late development:
Tunisian president steps down amid riots
Read more: http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2011/01/1 ... z1B2pdXA2i
maybe I am just a romantic taking a rosy view of the world, but when a popular uprising gets rid of a bad leader it makes me feel good. Problem is that all it does is create an oppurtunity for the next bad leader.
Since 1410 most Welsh people most of the time have abandoned any idea of independence as unthinkable. But since 1410 most Welsh people, at some time or another, if only in some secret corner of the mind, have been "out with Owain and his barefoot scrubs." For the Welsh mind is still haunted by it's lightning-flash vision of a people that was free.
Gwyn A. Williams,
Gwyn A. Williams,