Italian Scientists Found Guilty of Manslaughter

Post by **Lalaith** » Mon Oct 22, 2012 7:47 pm

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2012 ... ml?cmp=rss

Italian scientists found guilty of manslaughter after failing to predict an earthquake.

Really? This seems so wrong to me.

Post by **Dave_LF** » Mon Oct 22, 2012 8:09 pm

Alright then. Good luck finding anyone else to take that job in the future. Although there may be individuals on the other side of the Ionian who are desperate enough.

Mon Oct 22, 2012 9:13 pm

That's totally nuts.

Post by **Lalaith** » Mon Oct 22, 2012 11:00 pm

I agree. I wouldn't work as a scientist in Italy now. I am hoping that they are able to appeal and overturn the decision. It seemed like it was a possibility from the article.

I guess meteorologists are next? "You didn't predict exactly where that tornado was going to go!"

Post by **WampusCat** » Tue Oct 23, 2012 7:59 am

How absurd!

Post by **River** » Tue Oct 23, 2012 11:47 am

WTF?

I thought it was impossible to make any predictions at all about seismic or volcanic activity.

Post by **Lalaith** » Tue Oct 23, 2012 12:40 pm

Me too, which is why this is so insane and disturbing. The people in this area are acting on their emotions and ignoring reason altogether.

Tue Oct 23, 2012 2:07 pm

There must be something more to this than is being reported in this article. There has to be, doesn't there?

Post by **Alatar** » Tue Oct 23, 2012 3:30 pm

I'm assuming the same V. I can't imagine but that this is some sensationalist journalism giving one side of the story.

Post by **Dave_LF** » Tue Oct 23, 2012 3:49 pm

Yes and no. They are not being charged with failing to predict a quake, but rather with reassuring the public that the danger of a large quake was minimal when (in the court's opinion) the data didn't warrant that.

Post by **Lalaith** » Tue Oct 23, 2012 4:05 pm

The headline is definitely intended to be sensationalist, but Dave has the right of it, as far as I can tell. It's still absurd and a little frightening.

Post by **JewelSong** » Tue Oct 23, 2012 4:47 pm

Well, here's the story on the NY Times, which is hardly a sensationalist paper.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/23/world ... .html?_r=0

Tue Oct 23, 2012 5:55 pm

Thanks for the additional link, Jewel.

It just gets worse. According to that article, the prosecutors cited a U.S. case in which the Army Corp of Engineers was held responsible for the death and damage of Katrina. That is wrong and downright irresponsible on at least two different counts. First and foremost, that was not a criminal case in which individuals were sent to jail, it was civil case in which the government was held liable for monetary damages. And secondly, it was not a case of scientists failing to properly predict a risk, it was a case of knowing full well that there was a major risk and failing to take adequate measures to defend against the risk.

Post by **Lalaith** » Tue Oct 23, 2012 6:31 pm

Thanks for the article, Jewel, and for the additional, legal insight, Voronwë.

Post by **Primula Baggins** » Tue Oct 23, 2012 7:09 pm

Is it possible to use a legal precedent from another country? Aside from the whole issue of it not really being a precedent. . . .

Tue Oct 23, 2012 7:30 pm

They were not really using it as "precedent" in the sense that we think of using a previous case defining what the law is. They were more using it as an example of what they considered a comparable example. Even though, it isn't.

On a more general level, nel would be more qualified to speak, but courts do sometimes cite cases from other jurisdictions as "persuasive precedent" as opposed to "binding precedent".

Post by **Primula Baggins** » Tue Oct 23, 2012 7:33 pm

I feel better. Thanks.

Post by **anthriel** » Tue Oct 23, 2012 11:40 pm

I don't.

What complete and utter nonsense...

Post by **Holbytla** » Wed Oct 24, 2012 12:48 am

If someone were deliberately putting forth misleading information, or withholding pertinent information to the detriment of the public at large, then I could see where the Italian justice system were coming from.

I just don't see how such a guess-work like endeavor as plate tectonics, could fit into that category.

While I think that Captain Schettino's actions and inaction (aboard the Costa Concordia last January) were reprehensible and bespoke of someone who was in a panic and not fit to captain a navy vessel, I hardly think that the two issues are commensurate, and would find this issue even more disturbing if punishments were ended up near equal terms.

That isn't to say I think that Captain Schettino should receive the death penalty, but if you take the two on Italian justice face value, that is what you would get.