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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2016 4:36 am 
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Bumping this (from more than 9 years ago!!!) because it seems to be an actual discussion of MBTI and other similar systems. Plus it is full of the ghosts of all our pasts. woooOOOOooooo.

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― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King


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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2016 12:54 pm 
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Closer to ten years, actually.

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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2016 5:45 pm 
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Oh, c'mon! There are fully three posts from 2007.

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“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King


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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2016 6:40 pm 
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Yeah, January 2007. In case you have noticed, it's almost 2017!

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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2016 6:48 pm 
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Voronwë the Faithful wrote:
Yeah, January 2007. In case you have noticed, it's almost 2017!


Not possible.

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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2016 7:14 pm 
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It's 5777 and this thread is 3770 years old.

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‘There’s no greys, only white that’s got grubby. I’m surprised you don’t know that. And sin, young man, is when you treat people as things. Including yourself. That’s what sin is.’
‘It’s a lot more complicated than that -’
‘No. It ain’t. When people say things are a lot more complicated than that, they means they’re getting worried that they won’t like the truth. People as things, that’s where it starts.’
Terry Pratchett, Carpe Jugulum


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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:37 pm 
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Shanah tovah

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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 1:58 am 
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Lali Beag Bídeach
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Yes, Shanah tovah! I missed getting to say this to you all. :D

I should look around this old thread.

Anyway, I'll probably be talking to myself about the personality theory stuff, but here's more info on the Five Factor Theory (FFT)/Five Factor Model (FFM)/The Big Five.

A test here:
http://www.truity.com/test/big-five-personality-test

This is one of the few personality theories that really does a decent job of being technically scientific, like I said in the other thread. Unfortunately, that also makes it a little less...useful in a way, but it's still interesting.


Here are my Big Five results:

Openness:

You Are Highly Open to Experience

Your score for openness was high, at 87.5%.

Openness describes a person’s tendency to think in abstract, complex ways. High scorers are prone to associative thinking, meaning that they readily see relationships between things. People high in Openness are more able to connect seemingly unrelated concepts, making them more likely to appreciate art and unusual ideas.

People who are high in openness are typically:

Creative
Imaginative
Adventurous
Intellectual
Unconventional
Artistically Inclined

High Openness scorers are more likely to be politically liberal and to participate in artistic and cultural activities in their leisure time. They tend to be drawn to artistic and scientific careers. High Openness scorers are also more likely to have a high IQ.

Conscientiousness:

You Are Moderately Conscientious

Your score for conscientiousness was 70%, which is in the moderate range.

Conscientiousness describes a person’s ability to exercise self-discipline and control in order to pursue their goals. High scorers are organized and determined, and are able to forego immediate gratification for the sake of long-term achievement. Low scorers are impulsive and easily sidetracked.

The concept of Conscientiousness focuses on a dilemma we all face: shall I do what feels good now, or instead do what is less fun but will pay off in the future? Some people are more likely to choose fun in the moment, and thus are low in Conscientiousness. Others are more likely to work doggedly toward their goals, and thus are high in this trait.

Your score for Conscientious is in the moderate range, indicating that you are fairly average in your tendency to respond to impulses. You probably have some long-term goals and are fairly successful in pursuing them, but can be sidetracked sometimes when a particularly attractive diversion presents itself.

Extraversion:

You Are Moderately Extraverted

Your score for Extraversion was moderate, at 55%.

Extraversion describes a person’s inclination to seek stimulation from the outside world, especially in the form of attention from other people. Extraverts engage actively with others to earn friendship, admiration, power, status, excitement, and romance. Introverts, on the other hand, conserve their energy, and do not work as hard to earn these social rewards.

Extraversion seems to be related to the emotional payoff that a person gets from achieving a goal. While everyone experiences victories in life, it seems that extroverts are especially thrilled by these victories, especially when they earn the attention of others. Getting a promotion, finding a new romance, or winning an award are all likely to bring an extrovert great joy.

In contrast, introverts do not experience as much of a “high” from social achievements. Thus, they don’t make as much effort to seek them out. Introverts tend to be more content with simple, quiet lives, and rarely seek attention from others.

Your mid-range score on this dimension indicates that you are fairly average in your motivation to seek out social rewards. You probably have some desire for admiration, influence, and prestige, but you can also be content when you’re not winning recognition from others.

Agreeableness

You Are High in Agreeableness

Your score for Agreeableness was high, at 87.5%.

Agreeableness describes a person’s tendency to put others’ needs ahead of their own, and to cooperate rather than compete with others. People who are high in Agreeableness experience a great deal of empathy and tend to get pleasure out of serving and taking care of others.

People who are high in Agreeableness tend to be:

Kind
Sensitive
Cooperative
Compassionate

Agreeableness is a good predictor of the quality of relationships: people high in the trait are more likely to keep friends and less likely to fall out with people. They are more likely to think of other people kindly and to be forgiving of faults or slights.

Neuroticism:

You Are High in Neuroticism

Your score for Neuroticism was high, at 57.5%.

Neuroticism describes a person’s tendency to experience negative emotions, including fear, sadness, anxiety, guilt, and shame. While everyone experiences these emotions from time to time, people high in Neuroticism seem especially prone to them.

High Neuroticism scorers seem to react more strongly to situations and events that have the potential to provoke negative emotions. For instance, they would be more likely to feel threatened by a stranger passing on the street, or to interpret a comment from a colleague as an insult. High Neuroticism people have emotional systems that are on high alert, looking for danger and peril at every turn.

People high in Neuroticism are also more likely to doubt themselves and their abilities. They often feel personally responsible for their own bad luck, and feel a sense of shame when things don’t turn out the way they’d like.

While Neuroticism is not generally thought of as an asset, there are positive points. People high in Neuroticism are unlikely to overlook the perils of life, and tend to be realistic about the problems and limitations in the world. There is also some evidence that Neuroticism can push people to higher levels of achievement, provided they are generally well-adjusted. It seems the fear of failure can provide an important source of motivation.



(I do find it interesting that a score of 57.5% in neuroticism is called "high" while a score of 55% in extraversion was only "moderate." :P )

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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 2:17 am 
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not something I would recommend
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Huh. Yeah...these categories don't feel that useful somehow. Took the test anyways though. My scores:

Your score for openness was high, at 87.5%.
Your score for conscientiousness was low, at 50%.
Your score for Extraversion was low, at 45%.
Your score for Agreeableness was high, at 85%.
Your score for neuroticism was low, at 32.5%.

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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 2:37 am 
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Lali Beag Bídeach
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I think neuroticism is the only one that doesn't correlate well with the MBTI. (BTW, I like the description here of neuroticism: "Neuroticism describes how stable a person’s emotions are. The low extreme is a person so resilient nothing seems to faze them, good or bad, ever. On the high extreme is someone who is very emotionally responsive. Neither of these is better than the other, there are times where it is good to be resilient and others to be responsive. This simply describes where a person falls on average." )

Otherwise, there is at least a loose correlation, according to some, on the other traits.

Openness = Sensing vs. Intuition
Extraversion = Introversion vs. Extraversion (or Extroversion, as I like to spell it)
Conscientiousness = Judging vs. Perceiving
Agreeableness = Thinking vs. Feeling

What do you think?

(Going off of these results here, I'd be: ENFP, but borderline on the E and P. Hmmm. I usually test pretty high on P and moderate to high on I. You'd be: INFP.)

Hmmm.

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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 3:11 am 
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not something I would recommend
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Part of it might be that the phrasing has too much of a judgy tone, like it's telling you beforehand if it's good or bad to have a trait. Like you could take the test and get told "According to your score, you're a dull, unstable, jerk. Congrats!" :suspicious:

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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 3:45 am 
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Your score for openness was high, at 77.5%.
High Openness scorers are more likely to be politically liberal and to participate in artistic and cultural activities in their leisure time. They tend to be drawn to artistic and scientific careers. High Openness scorers are also more likely to have a high IQ.

Your score for conscientiousness was low, at 20%.
People who are low in Conscientiousness are more likely to develop addictions of all kinds, as they have trouble resisting the impulse to engage in pleasurable activities. They also have more disorganized homes and offices. On the other hand, they tend to be more flexible and spontaneous, and do well in unpredictable environments where they must respond to constantly changing circumstances.

Your score for Extraversion was moderate, at 50%.
Your mid-range score on this dimension indicates that you are fairly average in your motivation to seek out social rewards. You probably have some desire for admiration, influence, and prestige, but you can also be content when you’re not winning recognition from others.

Your score for Agreeableness was moderate, at 67.5%.
Your moderate score in Agreeableness indicates that you are fairly typical in the degree to which you balance your own interests with the interests of others. You are probably willing to sacrifice yourself for others some of the time, but you also watch out for yourself quite a bit.

Your score for Neuroticism was moderate, at 40%.
Your score indicates that you are fairly typical in your tendency to experience negative emotions. You probably feel sadness, worry, anger, and guilt about as much as the average person. You are neither overly reactive, nor especially resistant to the stresses of life.

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‘There’s no greys, only white that’s got grubby. I’m surprised you don’t know that. And sin, young man, is when you treat people as things. Including yourself. That’s what sin is.’
‘It’s a lot more complicated than that -’
‘No. It ain’t. When people say things are a lot more complicated than that, they means they’re getting worried that they won’t like the truth. People as things, that’s where it starts.’
Terry Pratchett, Carpe Jugulum


Last edited by Frelga on Thu Oct 06, 2016 5:39 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 4:25 am 
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The site froze while I was trying to do the test...I'll try again later.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 4:39 am 
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Mine.

Your score for openness was high, at 87.5%.

Your score for Conscientiousness was high, at 75%.

Your score for Extraversion was low, at 27.5%.

Your score for Agreeableness was moderate, at 60%.

Your score for Neuroticism was moderate, at 37.5%. What's interesting here is people who've dealt with me in person probably would score me lower. But I mask things.

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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 5:46 am 
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I cleaned up my last post so it doesn't take up quite as much space.

It's all pretty unobjectionable. The low conscientiousness score is no surprise, given that I have recently realized that I almost certainly have undiagnosed ADHD. It is, precisely, a disorder of the executive function, particularly the impulse control mechanism. In my case, it is somewhat balanced by a sense of duty instilled at an early age. That is accounted for in the agreeableness score to some extent, but it is not quite the same thing.

This is actually the first personality test I've seen that is capable of reflecting neurological disorders. Low extroversion plus high neuroticism, for example, could be correlated to social anxiety.

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‘There’s no greys, only white that’s got grubby. I’m surprised you don’t know that. And sin, young man, is when you treat people as things. Including yourself. That’s what sin is.’
‘It’s a lot more complicated than that -’
‘No. It ain’t. When people say things are a lot more complicated than that, they means they’re getting worried that they won’t like the truth. People as things, that’s where it starts.’
Terry Pratchett, Carpe Jugulum


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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 8:16 am 
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of Vinyamar
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Interesting. I wouldn't disagree with much of this, apart from the fact that there is no discrimination between consientuousness at work and in other aspects of life. I am very conscientious and work very hard at my hobbies. Also, I'm certainly not interested in money or power, although "status" could be applied to my desire to be recognised as an actor and director.


Quote:
YOU ARE HIGHLY OPEN TO EXPERIENCE
Your score for openness was high, at 87.5%.
High Openness scorers are more likely to be politically liberal and to participate in artistic and cultural activities in their leisure time. They tend to be drawn to artistic and scientific careers. High Openness scorers are also more likely to have a high IQ.

YOU ARE LOW IN CONSCIENTIOUSNESS
Your score for conscientiousness was low, at 12.5%.
People who are low in Conscientiousness are more likely to develop addictions of all kinds, as they have trouble resisting the impulse to engage in pleasurable activities. They also have more disorganized homes and offices. On the other hand, they tend to be more flexible and spontaneous, and do well in unpredictable environments where they must respond to constantly changing circumstances.

YOU ARE HIGHLY EXTRAVERTED
Your score for extraversion was high, at 85%.
People who are high in extraversion are more likely to have many friends and an active social life. They also tend to have more romantic relationships. Extraverts express more positive emotions than non-extroverts and typically have more energy.
Extraverts are also more likely to be ambitious and interested in increasing their social standing. They tend to work hard to achieve power and prestige and get a special thrill from going after rewards such as money, status, or attention from others.

YOU ARE HIGH IN AGREEABLENESS
Your score for Agreeableness was high, at 75%.
Agreeableness is a good predictor of the quality of relationships: people high in the trait are more likely to keep friends and less likely to fall out with people. They are more likely to think of other people kindly and to be forgiving of faults or slights.

YOU ARE MODERATE IN NEUROTICISM
Your score for Neuroticism was moderate, at 35%.
Your score indicates that you are fairly typical in your tendency to experience negative emotions. You probably feel sadness, worry, anger, and guilt about as much as the average person. You are neither overly reactive, nor especially resistant to the stresses of life.


The thing is, I have no problem with these tests as a way to highlight one's strengths and weaknesses. I have a huge problem with using them to treat people differently or to target their strengths and weaknesses for a company's gain. As I explained to my daughter when choosing her University course, what people are good at, and what they enjoy are not always the same thing. I don't want to be railroaded into a maths based discipline simply because I'm good at it, when I would rather be making less money in something I enjoy, but have no real aptitude for.

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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 12:13 pm 
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Lali already touched on this, but it's important to understand that the definition of "neuroticism" used on this test is different from the word's general meaning*. It has to do with how susceptible people are to negative emotions (sadness, paranoia, jealousy, anger), and how quickly they recover from them. Some versions of the test try to avoid confusion by inverting the score and renaming it "emotional stability." As (evidently) the most neurotic person here**, I feel obliged to point this out. :blackeye:

I think big-5 is less fun than MB because it tends to just echo back what you tell it. MB at its best will take your answers and use them to make predictions in areas it didn't ask about at all. Except, it doesn't always work. For some people, it doesn't seem to work at all.

*Why do people insist on appropriating well-understood words from common circulation and reusing them as technical terms with related but quite different meanings? :nono:

**o=90, c=60, e=35, a=80, n=67.5


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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 12:59 pm 
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not something I would recommend
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Dave_LF wrote:
*Why do people insist on appropriating well-understood words from common circulation and reusing them as technical terms with related but quite different meanings? :nono:


Eh, who cares.

(n = 32.5%)

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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 1:04 pm 
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I think that's really more of a c thing. Or maybe it lies at the intersection. :D


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 Post subject: Re: Myers-Briggs, redux
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 2:08 pm 
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Here's mine:

YOU ARE HIGHLY OPEN TO EXPERIENCE
Your score for openness was high, at 92.5%.

YOU ARE MODERATELY CONSCIENTIOUS
Your score for conscientiousness was 55%, which is in the moderate range.

YOU ARE MODERATELY EXTRAVERTED
Your score for Extraversion was moderate, at 55%.

YOU ARE HIGH IN AGREEABLENESS
Your score for Agreeableness was high, at 85%.

YOU ARE LOW IN NEUROTICISM
Your score for neuroticism was low, at 30%.

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