The Hobbit: BotFA Trailer discussion with SPOILERS

[Voronwë the Faithful]

Also, I'm very pleased that Bilbo puts the Ring on. That suggests that his role in the battle is at least partly going to parallel the book (though I doubt he will get knocked out).

[Passdagas the Brown]

I have a feeling Bilbo will participate in the battle for a while, killing stuff and saving a few of his friends here and there, and then he will get knocked out. PJ has a tendency to make massive changes, but then include a few of the more iconic moments. We got "good morning" and I think we'll get this one.

[Passdagas the Brown]

I think a lot of the "Massive" shots (if they are still using that technology) look painfully fake, though. Particularly the ones of the elven army lined up before the front gate.

But I find the massive shots kind of boring at this point anyway. I think they could replace them all with claymation without having much effect on my enjoyment.

They're not only boring to me. They take me right out of a film (and did so in TTT and ROTK as well). They simply do not look very good, and have been overdone in countless films since LOTR.

Was watching the initial tank battle between Patton and Rommel (well, Rommel's subordinate) in Patton yesterday, which is on a pretty epic scale. And despite its age, it looks vastly better than anything PJ has produced with Massive technology. I understand that there's a need for CGI to insert trolls and bats and eagles and such, but a better balance of real people and CGI is certainly preferable, non?

In any event, I liked this trailer (and the piano at the beginning strikes me as very fitting for this material...).

[Voronwë the Faithful]

I have a feeling Bilbo will participate in the battle for a while, killing stuff and saving a few of his friends here and there, and then he will get knocked out. PJ has a tendency to make massive changes, but then include a few of the more iconic moments. We got "good morning" and I think we'll get this one.

I told you all along that we would get "good morning".

You may well be right about this. I hope so, but I'm not wedded to it like I was to "good morning".

[Passdagas the Brown]

Sorry, I was wrong. There is one shot (at 1:26) of the Iron Hill dwarves seemingly firing ballista arrows at the elven army (though it may be cut just to seem that way, and they could just as well be firing at bats).

[Passdagas the Brown]

I have a feeling Bilbo will participate in the battle for a while, killing stuff and saving a few of his friends here and there, and then he will get knocked out. PJ has a tendency to make massive changes, but then include a few of the more iconic moments. We got "good morning" and I think we'll get this one.

I told you all along that we would get "good morning".

You may well be right about this. I hope so, but I'm not wedded to it like I was to "good morning".

Oh right, yeah. I remember you saying that.

[Passdagas the Brown]

Also, that thing people have been saying is a troll (we get a closeup of him at 1:57) is either a mini-troll of some kind, or just a very large orc that acts as a "troll-wrangler," or something. From 1:34-1:37, you see him in front of the massive battle trolls, leading them forward, and he's much smaller than they are.

ETA: This may be how PJ is distinguishing between the more intelligent, talking "hill trolls" of AUJ and the "mountain trolls" of BOTFA and LOTR.

[Elentári]

Also, that thing people have been saying is a troll (we get a closeup of him at 1:57) is either a mini-troll of some kind, or just a very large orc that acts as a "troll-wrangler," or something. From 1:34-1:37, you see him in front of the massive battle trolls, leading them forward, and he's much smaller than they are.

ETA: This may be how PJ is distinguishing between the more intelligent, talking "hill trolls" of AUJ and the "mountain trolls" of BOTFA and LOTR.

There have been suggestions elsewhere that he might be the new leader of the Misty Mountain Goblins, perhaps related to the deceased Goblin King?

[eborr]

BATS - c'mon Tolkien scholars where are the Bats in middle earth, perhaps the notion is that the enemy made bats to mock the birds of Gods creation.

Perhaps there are some other random creatures, from Dungeons and Dragons that can be dragged into the battle of 5(6,8,12) armies, shall we see the amorphous blob perhaps

[Passdagas the Brown]

There have been suggestions elsewhere that he might be the new leader of the Misty Mountain Goblins, perhaps related to the deceased Goblin King?

Ah, yes. That may be it. Would explain why PJ is bothering to show us Gundabad, when he already showed us Sauron's army at Dol Guldur. We may, in fact, be getting two separate orc armies, that may or may not be coordinated...one led by the Goblin King's son, and the other by Azog and company...

[Alatar]

The bats are book canon eborr. Or were you being funny?

I loved the trailer. But as I have said before, I'm easily pleased.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

BATS - c'mon Tolkien scholars where are the Bats in middle earth, perhaps the notion is that the enemy made bats to mock the birds of Gods creation.

"Although it was not yet very cold, they tried lighting watch-fires at night, but they soon gave that up. It seemed to bring hundreds and hundreds of eyes all round them, though the creatures, whatever they were, were careful never to let their bodies show in the little flicker of the flames. Worse still it brought thousands of dark-grey and black moths, some nearly as big as your hand, flapping and whirring round their ears. They could not stand that, nor the huge bats, black as a top-hat, either; so they gave up fires and sat at night and dozed in the enormous uncanny darkness."
Chapter 8 - Flies and Spiders

"A whirl of bats frightened from slumber by their smoking torches flurried over them; as they sprang forward their feet slithered on stones rubbed smooth and slimed by the passing of the dragon. Now before them the water fell noisily outward and foamed down towards the valley. They flung their pale torches to the ground, and stood gazing out with dazzled eyes. They were come to the Front Gate, and were looking out upon Dale."
Chapter 13 - Not at Home

"'Halt!' cried Gandalf, who appeared suddenly, and stood alone, with arms uplifted, between the advancing dwarves and the ranks awaiting them. 'Halt!' he called in a voice like thunder, and his staff blazed forth with a flash like the lightning. 'Dread has come upon you all! Alas! it has come more swiftly than I guessed. The Goblins are upon you! Bolg of the North is coming. O Dain! whose father you slew in Moria. Behold! the bats are above his army like a sea of locusts. They ride upon wolves and Wargs are in their train!'"

"Day drew on. The goblins gathered again in the valley. There a host of Wargs came ravening and with them came the bodyguard of Bolg, goblins of huge size with scimitars of steel. Soon actual darkness was coming into a stormy sky; while still the great bats swirled about the heads and ears of elves and men, or fastened vampire-like on the stricken. Now Bard was fighting to defend the Eastern spur, and yet giving slowly back; and the elf-lords were at bay about their king upon the southern arm, near to the watch-post on Ravenhill."
Chapter 17 - The Clouds Burst

[eborr]

I stand corrected adopting a humble stance

[Passdagas the Brown]

You could have gotten away with it, eborr. I assumed you were joking!

[Voronwë the Faithful]

We can still assume that!

[Passdagas the Brown]

Wow. A mere five people here on HoF are interested in talking about the last trailer for the last Middle Earth film by Peter Jackson. Wonder if that says something about waning interest, at least among Tolkien fans...

[Primula Baggins]

The bats "black as a top-hat"? That's one of the Hobbit moments that has flung me out for a bit when I reach it. A top-hat! In Middle-earth! Waistcoats I can get—they serve a functional role in keeping one warm, and I can imagine there was a Westron word for such a garment. And tea. Infusion of leaves, hot and soothing, yes. Pipeweed brings me up a bit short, but if I don't jib at potatoes, I shouldn't at that either. But a top-hat?

I haven't watched the trailer yet, so I'll step out until I have.

[Elentári]

Wow. A mere five people here on HoF are interested in talking about the last trailer for the last Middle Earth film by Peter Jackson. Wonder if that says something about waning interest, at least among Tolkien fans...

That's four more than TORC...

[Elentári]

Anyway... here is IGN's breakdown of the trailer in their Rewind Theater:

http://uk.ign.com/videos/2014/11/06/rew ... -trailer-2

[Passdagas the Brown]

The bats "black as a top-hat"? That's one of the Hobbit moments that has flung me out for a bit when I reach it. A top-hat! In Middle-earth! Waistcoats I can get—they serve a functional role in keeping one warm, and I can imagine there was a Westron word for such a garment. And tea. Infusion of leaves, hot and soothing, yes. Pipeweed brings me up a bit short, but if I don't jib at potatoes, I shouldn't at that either. But a top-hat?

I haven't watched the trailer yet, so I'll step out until I have.

Or how about "pop-gun"? As in "It is not like you, Bilbo, to keep friends waiting on the mat, and then open the door like a pop-gun!"

Or the "express train" reference in FOTR..."The dragon passed like an express train, turned a somersault, and burst over Bywater with a deafening explosion."