The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies

[Elentári]

I saw a suggestion that it might be an inventory of Erebor! Or it could be Balin checking the terms of the contract re: Bilbo's 14th share...

And regarding the simultaneous screening in Wellington, I wonder (cynically) how much of that is more damage limitation in response to the Kiwi actors missing the London jolly?

[Voronwë the Faithful]

Yeah, I thought that myself.

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[Smaug's voice]

I'm learning to like the pig, though it being likened to Pumba from Lion King is quite absurd imo.

I love the new images from V's link! Whether I end up liking the film or not, I'll surely love the 'feels' of the interiors of Erebor.

[Dave_LF]

The whole idea of a dwarf riding a pig is such an over-the-top RPG-style concept, does it really make any difference what type of pig it is?

[Frelga]

I wonder if PJ really wanted to make an over the top action comedy with big fights. I kinda wish he actually did that.

[kzer_za]

PJ might be good at directing comic book movies. Despite my distaste for the genre, he's just idiosyncratic enough that he could probably make it work. If the studio didn't interfere too much, anyway.

[Passdagas the Brown]

The whole idea of a dwarf riding a pig is such an over-the-top RPG-style concept, does it really make any difference what type of pig it is?

Well, a lot of RPG stuff does draw from the sometimes absurd well of myth, so it doesn't bother me.

As for whether or not it really matters what kind of pig it is...

Here's a giant boar from the movie Hercules (an admittedly terrible film, but this guy looks interesting): http://www.fxguide.com/featured/legend- ... -hercules/

And then there's the pot-bellied pig Dain's riding.

But as I said before, it doesn't bother me much, especially if it's part of a humorous characterization of Dain as a secret softie (e.g. he never leaves home without his trusty pet pig, or something like that). But if they actually intended for his mount to be intimidating, they failed (judging just from this photo).

Personally, I think PJ is having a laugh.

[Passdagas the Brown]

It's definitely a mystery! Hopefully it will make some sort of sense in context.

Edit: This was in response to the comment/question about Gandalf's comment about the dwarves not being meant to enter Erebor.

Yup, agree with Frelga....I think Gandalf's words are referring to Sauron's plans...HE meant to stop Thorin via Azog, before he got anywhere near the Lonely Mountain...

That makes sense.

Have you read those articles at Dark Jackal's site? Anything worthwhile?

ETA: I see that some pretty woman elsewhere said "further confirmation it was the Studio that asked for the Love-triangle, in the FilmInk article...


Lilly says that there was no triangle in Principal Photography, then the suits watched the rough cut and said they were confused about what was happening with the characters (Legolas, Tauriel, Kili) so they realized they (I paraphrase) needed to make the storyline less subtle to come over better... "

This really makes me wonder about how heavy a hand Warner Brothers had in this production. They may be more responsible than we think for some of the more lackluster and conventional elements of the films.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

I don't know about that. There have been multiple references to this one item, and only this one item. That suggests to me that the studio's influence may have been limited to ... this one item. I definitely think it is unfortunate, as I much would have preferred them to keep it more subtle, but I don't really see it as a big deal (subject to what happens in the "final chapter" of course).

[Passdagas the Brown]

That's probably right. But I think the love story is going to play out in all its obviousness in BOTFA.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

I hope not, but at least Tauriel is purty.

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[Passdagas the Brown]

That's something we can agree on.

[Smaug's voice]

I don't know about that. There have been multiple references to this one item, and only this one item. That suggests to me that the studio's influence may have been limited to ... this one item.

I'm quite sure the three film split was mostly or purely WB's interjection.
And that is hurting this trilogy much more than the inclusion of an interspecies love story. Nearly every problem I have with these films stems from this split; OTT chases, rushed CGI, orc-fights wherever possible, a clichéd arch nemesis-subplot, and lots of bloated fillers that drag down the films.

PS: I also think Kili - the non bearded dwarf, was WB's idea as PJ himself doesn't have much of a reason to change that from the book.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

Upon what evidence are these conclusions based?

[Elentári]

Jackson had every reason to change Kili's beard....the agenda was to choose a good-looking young actor that the audience would buy into believing an Elf could have an attraction to. No matter that they'd have us believe the attraction was a cerebral/emotional one, no one on the team obviously thought the audience would buy it if the dwarf in question looked like Gimli. Now, how much of that was Jackson and how much the Studio, who knows... The Chronicles books would have us believe that they tried heavier prosthetics on Turner, but his bone structure was "too fine" and the look "didn't work." Convenient...<shrug> It's a shame they didn't have the relationship with Fili instead since he looks more believable as a Dwarf. I can understand it had to be either of the two young-uns, because of their different outlook on the world to the older Dwarves, but in reality, I could see Bofur (like Nesbitt himself) as being the Dwarf who could charm the pants of any female!

[Elentári]

Oh, and an "international" TV spot - 'ware the voiceover!

[Elentári]

EMPIRE Magazine special Jackson/HOBBIT issue...

scans of main article, contents page, interview with Wood and Freeman and nifty infographic! (clickies)



Too many pages to do everything but if anyone sees a particular article on the Jackson/M-e contents page that they want, PM me!

Now to sit down and actually read it!

[Smaug's voice]

WB has significant history being involved in 'milking' of blockbuster franchises.
This is even more clear with the TH films given how suddenly the announcements regarding the three film split was made. I'm quite sure that if PJ wanted to make TH into a trilogy, it would have been a trilogy right from the time he came on to the helm and not merely six months prior to the film-release. I think WB's involvement in this is transparent as glass here.

As for Kili, having a beard or not. I think PJ showed the Gimli-Galadriel interaction quite well in FotR. So if they wanted to show a mutual attraction between two species - and not a love story - I can't see why PJ would decide against beards. In this case, either the report stating WB 'demanding a love story' is false, or the ones stating 'PJ turned it into a love story'.

PS: V, those were not conclusions. neither are these evidences.
Simply my thoughts on the matter, which can very well be proved wrong.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

Elen, you are amazing!

SV, I don't find those arguments particularly compelling, but unless you have a strong desire to have me do so, I'm not going to debate you about it.

[Passdagas the Brown]

There is, however, a middle ground between Kili and Gimli.

I think they struck that balance rather well with Fili, but went too far away from "dwarf" with Kili.

I am glad, however, that they minimized prosthetics for the main dwarves so that we could actually relate to them as humans. If there's one thing I dislike more than the overuse of CGI, it's the overuse of prosthetics on human (or humanoid) characters. Gimli's face always looked to me like a surgical procedure had gone horribly wrong. Which was especially a shame since JRD had such a wonderfully dwarven face to begin with! PJ should have seen his allergy as a sign. Let actors act with their own faces, and the Gods will smile upon you!