The closest thing is probably the "roguelike" genre of games, which feature randomly generated levels and permanent player death (so you can't reload after you die). They require very careful play, adaptation to the levels and items you're given, and dozens (or more) of deaths to master. It is virtually inconceivable to win one when starting out, and even expert players can still sometimes lose. But they are a pretty niche genre because of their punishing difficulty, usually low-budget freeware games.I also wonder: is the review colored by its appearance in a gaming magazine, since, I guess, games more consistently than life reward players for their skill? I'm no gamer: are there video games in which you can make all the right moves, and then still lose because sometimes things just don't work out?
Desolation of Smaug reviews
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Passdagas the Brown
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They may have a small audience, but they go back to the 1970s and are still being developed! One reason I enjoy is that they're challenging without demanding too much of my time. I spend much less time on games than I used to, so I almost always leave long single-player games unfinished.Passdagas the Brown wrote:They are unpopular primarily because people don't want to experience the disappointments of real life in the virtual world.
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Passdagas the Brown
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kzer,
Understood. I tend to stay away from those types of games because my professional life is so challenging and stressful. As such, I prefer games that offer a more casual escape, but with engaging worlds and storylines.
Alatar,
That's a good question. The likely answers are ignorance and prestige.
People who make such criticisms of games are ignorant of the good ones, and it's culturally acceptable (and even encouraged) to disparage video games in general. In this context, the worst defines the whole genre.
Film, on the other hand, is deemed by the cultural cognoscenti as a more prestigious art form than the video game. In this context, the best defines the genre (and all films are judged against the best).
Personally, I appreciate both fields of entertainment, but feel that they are both better off when they stay in their lanes. Games that are too much like films, and films that are too much like games, generally leave me cold.
Understood. I tend to stay away from those types of games because my professional life is so challenging and stressful. As such, I prefer games that offer a more casual escape, but with engaging worlds and storylines.
Alatar,
That's a good question. The likely answers are ignorance and prestige.
People who make such criticisms of games are ignorant of the good ones, and it's culturally acceptable (and even encouraged) to disparage video games in general. In this context, the worst defines the whole genre.
Film, on the other hand, is deemed by the cultural cognoscenti as a more prestigious art form than the video game. In this context, the best defines the genre (and all films are judged against the best).
Personally, I appreciate both fields of entertainment, but feel that they are both better off when they stay in their lanes. Games that are too much like films, and films that are too much like games, generally leave me cold.
Definitely a form of masochism.Whereas I love them! Psychoanalyze that!
It was probably Nethack waaay back in the 80s that really ignited my love of games.
As to video games, people can only judge what they know and since the vast majority still don't really play them they only know what's most visibly popular - which is almost always very violent shooters.
On a vaguely related note, it occurred to me recently that their might not be a single video game character from the last 20 years that would be recognizable to a general public, with the possible exception of maybe Lara Croft. Games have become increasingly succesful on both commercial and critical levels yet somehow still managed to be seen or treated as a culturally niche interest. It's very weird that GTA 5 can set mind-shatteringly incredible sales records and yet my non-video gamers friends will say things like "GTA? Is that some kinda racing game?"
As to video games, people can only judge what they know and since the vast majority still don't really play them they only know what's most visibly popular - which is almost always very violent shooters.
On a vaguely related note, it occurred to me recently that their might not be a single video game character from the last 20 years that would be recognizable to a general public, with the possible exception of maybe Lara Croft. Games have become increasingly succesful on both commercial and critical levels yet somehow still managed to be seen or treated as a culturally niche interest. It's very weird that GTA 5 can set mind-shatteringly incredible sales records and yet my non-video gamers friends will say things like "GTA? Is that some kinda racing game?"
I wanna love somebody but I don't know how
I wanna throw my body in the river and drown
-The Decemberists
I wanna throw my body in the river and drown
-The Decemberists
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Voronwë the Faithful
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Voronwë the Faithful wrote:I still have "Pong" come to mind when I hear the words "video game".
"What do you fear, lady?" Aragorn asked.
"A cage," Éowyn said. "To stay behind bars, until use and old age accept them, and all chance of doing great deeds is gone beyond recall or desire.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
"A cage," Éowyn said. "To stay behind bars, until use and old age accept them, and all chance of doing great deeds is gone beyond recall or desire.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
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Passdagas the Brown
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I don't know if V or Al or someone else could answer this, but there used to be a TORC member that was a professor of "games and myth" at I believe, Connecticut College. His students got to play and analyze a lot of games, including how they related to mythic structures.
Some students were reported to have said: "Best. Class. Eva."
Do you remember his name or screen name, by any chance?
Some students were reported to have said: "Best. Class. Eva."
Do you remember his name or screen name, by any chance?
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Voronwë the Faithful
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Passdagas the Brown
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One thing that really bugged me, and which I feel is a more important problem than the odd properties of molten dwarvish gold or the spider translation services of the One Ring, was Bofur's line when he goes back to Bard's house for help with Kili.
He says, as a rationale for seeking Bard out: "No one will help us."
If I am not mistaken, in the scene immediately prior, the dwarves were feted as heroes, and had been warmly embraced by the people of Laketown based on a promise of shared wealth and fulfilled prophecies.
Why in the world would they have been shunned, in this context?
Would it not be in everyone's interest to help save the life of a dwarf, and perhaps incur a handsome reward?
IMO, this was the sloppiest piece of storytelling in the whole film. Made very little sense.
He says, as a rationale for seeking Bard out: "No one will help us."
If I am not mistaken, in the scene immediately prior, the dwarves were feted as heroes, and had been warmly embraced by the people of Laketown based on a promise of shared wealth and fulfilled prophecies.
Why in the world would they have been shunned, in this context?
Would it not be in everyone's interest to help save the life of a dwarf, and perhaps incur a handsome reward?
IMO, this was the sloppiest piece of storytelling in the whole film. Made very little sense.
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Voronwë the Faithful
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I took the implication to be that if Thorin couldn't be bothered to take the sick dwarf with him, he wasn't worth bothering with. I thought that actually fit rather well with the environment that the Master and Alfrid had created in Laketown.
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
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sauronsfinger
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that is a whole lot more tech advanced than me V.Voronwë the Faithful wrote:I still have "Pong" come to mind when I hear the words "video game".
the only video game I ever played was which cord hooked where on the VCR.
I usually lost.
There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers
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Smaug's voice
- Nibonto Aagun
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I won't call it the sloppiest but I too was surprised by it in the film.Passdagas the Brown wrote:One thing that really bugged me, and which I feel is a more
important problem than the odd properties of molten dwarvish gold or the
spider translation services of the One Ring, was Bofur's line when he
goes back to Bard's house for help with Kili.
He says, as a rationale for seeking Bard out: "No one will help us."
If I am not mistaken, in the scene immediately prior, the dwarves were
feted as heroes, and had been warmly embraced by the people of Laketown
based on a promise of shared wealth and fulfilled prophecies.
Why in the world would they have been shunned, in this context?
Would it not be in everyone's interest to help save the life of a dwarf,
and perhaps incur a handsome reward?
IMO, this was the sloppiest piece of storytelling in the whole film.
Made very little sense.
V - why wouldn't anyone want to help him? I think everyone saw how fond of Kili Thorin was and that they were forced to leave him behind.
I think even that even the Master would have taken him in if only to gain favor of the townsfolk.
Agreed, it was sloppy. To cut from the townsfolk giving the Dwarves a heroes' send-off to saying "no one will help us" was one of those 
moments. The only good thing to come out of Kili being jnjured, in any case, was that it gave Fili a strong character moment, which has been sorely lacking so far.
moments. The only good thing to come out of Kili being jnjured, in any case, was that it gave Fili a strong character moment, which has been sorely lacking so far.There is magic in long-distance friendships. They let you relate to other human beings in a way that goes beyond being physically together and is often more profound.
~Diana Cortes
~Diana Cortes
Agreed, it was sloppy. To cut from the townsfolk giving the Dwarves a heroes' send-off to Bofur saying "no one will help us" was one of those moments. The only good thing to come out of Kili being jnjured, in any case, was that it gave Fili a strong character moment, which has been sorely lacking so far.
moments. The only good thing to come out of Kili being jnjured, in any case, was that it gave Fili a strong character moment, which has been sorely lacking so far.There is magic in long-distance friendships. They let you relate to other human beings in a way that goes beyond being physically together and is often more profound.
~Diana Cortes
~Diana Cortes
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Smaug's voice
- Nibonto Aagun
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Again agreed.Elentári wrote:Agreed,
it was sloppy. To cut from the townsfolk giving the Dwarves a heroes'
send-off to saying "no one will help us" was one of those
The only good thing to come out of Kili being jnjured, in any case, was
that it gave Fili a strong character moment, which has been sorely
lacking so far.
I think my opinion matches with Elentári most on this board. So far.
