The Hobbit DVD/Blu-Ray Releases

[Passdagas the Brown]

But surely that's to reflect the lighter, more fairy tale tone of the film, Al?

Not sure if this sarcasm is aimed at me, but if it is I don't get the point of it. I've always argued for a Hobbit closer to LotR. I'm not one of those "Let the Hobbit be the Hobbit" people. I just don't happen to agree with some of PJs decisions in reaching that goal.

Understood. However, I don't think the "type" of juvenility (not a word) on display in PJ's film is at all similar to the tone of Tolkien's "the Hobbit."

PJ didn't just "let the Hobbit be the Hobbit." He turned it into one of his fantasy amusement park rides, which he loves so much.

A few whiffs of Tolkien at the beginning, and towards the end, and that's about it, IMO.

[Passdagas the Brown]

I like the new scene, but it seems that it is yet another example of the writers creating a non-sequitur by shoehorning good, but context-inappropriate Tolkien dialog in where it doesn't fit. "It's unwise to seek the counsel of elves, for they will answer both yes and no." Great, but who asked for counsel? Absolutely no one.

What makes it especially aggravating is that it would be so simple to rectify this, which suggests the writers aren't even aware of the problem:

Elrond: I've heard that Hobbits are very resilient.
Bilbo: Really?
Elrond: Nods
Bilbo: Do...do you truly believe a Hobbit could be fit for a quest in the wild?
Elrond: ...I've also heard they're fond of the comforts of home.
Bilbo: And I've heard that it's unwise to seek the counsel of elves, for they will answer both yes and no.

There; add something like the blue line and it's all better.

Edit: Spelling

Not to compete, but I think there's a stronger (and subtler) way to make the point.

Bilbo, alone, awkwardly walks through the archway, and over to Elrond, who is standing on the balcony (or in a library, or whatever).

Elrond: Not with your companions?
Bilbo: I shan't be missed. Truth is, most of them don't think I should be on this journey.
Elrond: I've heard that Hobbits are very resilient.
Bilbo: Really?
Elrond: Nods
Elrond: ...I've also heard they're fond of the comforts of home.
Bilbo: And I've heard that it's unwise to seek the counsel of elves, for they will answer both yes and no.

The only difference between this and PJ's is that Bilbo, who feels out of place with the dwarves, is the one who seeks a conversation with Elrond, not the other way around. That small change infinitely improves the dialogue, IMO, and enhances Bilbo's character. Otherwise, the dialogue does indeed seem clipped, unnatural, and just a tad nonsensical.

This is one of those many reasons why I think PJ, Fran and Philippa are simply not very good story-tellers. In the LOTR films, there are numerous examples of this "cut-and-paste" from Tolkien stuff, that simply doesn't work.

IMO.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

And in my opinion, in this case you are trying to hard to be critical.

And in my opinion, there are numerous examples in the LOTR films of the screenwriters taking Tolkien dialog and using it in different ways to very good effect. Like Grima addressing Éowyn with the words that in the book Gandalf used about her, which I thought was extremely effective. Or Faramir stating aloud what was Sam's thought in the book about the Southron soldier and whether he really was evil.

And in my opinion, this little scene works very well just as it is, with Bilbo feeling alienated and alone, and kindly Elrond seeing that and coming to his comfort, but with typically ambiguous Elvish advise. Indeed, I think that is better that having Bilbo actually approach Elrond, which he would be too afraid to do. If they had they had him do that, then his sudden audacity in making the statement to Elrond about hearing that Elves say both yes and no -- and then his awkward fear that he had overstepped his place -- would have had much less effect. No, in this case, I score one for the "terrible filmmakers" above our new flatulent friend of the dark, burnished color.

IMO.

[yovargas]

I like PtB's version. It does feel more natural.

[Dave_LF]

Dave's addition clarifies the rest of the lines, but it's also a bit "on the nose." I think Bilbo's earnest, questioning look was a pretty clear request for "counsel."

Ok; I buy that. Maybe just a "and what do you think?" then. I also like PtB's suggestion of having Bilbo approach Elrond instead of the other way around.

And in my opinion, there are numerous examples in the LOTR films of the screenwriters taking Tolkien dialog and using it in different ways to very good effect. Like Grima addressing Éowyn with the words that in the book Gandalf used about her, which I thought was extremely effective.

You're taunting me, right? When this topic has come up before, I've argued that that was the most egregious example of context-disregarding copy/paste in the entire script. But I seem to be alone on that one.

[Alatar]

Someone on TORN suggested that perhaps the image on the front of the EEs is one of those lenticular 3D images that can be peeled off to reveal a nice "The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey" matching the LotR Version.

I shall endeavor to believe against all hope that he is right!

[Voronwë the Faithful]

I find it interesting that that is such a big deal to people. Personally, I kind of like the fact that the box has a design element consistent with the LOTR EE's, but an addition that sets it apart. But I appear to be a definite minority on that!

Speaking of which, Dave I did not recall that you had expressed that opinion previously.

[Passdagas the Brown]

Oh, I wouldn't want the same exact design as the LOTR: EEs. But I would want a design that wasn't awful, like this one.

I mean, a weathered "parchment-esque" background, with a completely jarring rectangular and photo-realistic scene slapped on top of it, is not the height of art, I would say.

[Elentári]

An interesting post from tripecac ov er on TORn, where he suggests that WB have confirmed that the DoS 'sneak peek' preview is part of the 9 hours of new material on the EE...

According to the latest email from WB, the DoS preview is part of the bonus features.

So it looks like the 9 hours includes:

1) Commentary -- 3 hrs plus credits assuming they talk the whole time
2) New Zealand: Home of Middle Earth -- 6.5 minutes if it's the same one as on the theatrical release
3) Desolation of Smaug Preview -- about an hour if they use the whole thing
4) Appendices

This means 4 of the 9 hours will be the commentary track plus the stuff we've already seen. No new video.

That leaves 5 hours of "new" video.

I put "new" in quotes because I don't know how much of the Appendix material we've already seen. Hopefully there isn't too much overlap with the vlogs and the other promotional featurettes (e.g., the character profiles might be the same ones posted on the "Eiga" site back in May.)

I suspect that very little of the "new" video will actually feel new to us. There were so many vlogs, featurettes, interviews, and behind-the-scenes reels released before and around the time of the first film's release that it seems unlikely there are many "mysteries" left. In other words, I think we've been thoroughly "spoiled" as far as behind-the-scenes material for An Unexpected Journey.

[Alatar]

Where on Earth is he getting the figure of 1 hour for DOS sneak peek?

[Alatar]

Does anyone know if this is faked? I can't find an official source for it:

[Elentári]

Does anyone know if this is faked? I can't find an official source for it:

The first I saw of it was from this link

Did you see this comment from TORn?

Anything else floating out there, including the collector's set, aren't yet approved from the studio. That isn't to say they aren't genuine, but so far, they aren't official.

[Elentári]

Where on Earth is he getting the figure of 1 hour for DOS sneak peek?

I assume he's referring the to live event that we needed the DVD/Blu Ray code for which was indeed an hour long...

[Dave_LF]

But I appear to be a definite minority on that!

Speaking of which, Dave I did not recall that you had expressed that opinion previously.

I believe you. It seems hideously incongruous to me to have Grima speaking gentle, kindly words when context, body language, and tone of voice all say he's making a threat, and for him to phrase the whole thing hypothetically when he's speaking directly to the subject of his musings, but obviously no one else is bothered.

[Passdagas the Brown]

But I appear to be a definite minority on that!

Speaking of which, Dave I did not recall that you had expressed that opinion previously.

I believe you. It seems hideously incongruous to me to have Grima speaking gentle, kindly words when context, body language, and tone of voice all say he's making a threat, and for him to phrase the whole thing hypothetically when he's speaking directly to the subject of his musings, but obviously no one else is bothered.

Not so fast! I was plenty bothered by it.

It is the sort of thing that is quite easily dismissed as "pseudo-Shakespearean," because when removed from its original context (which was one of Gandalf describing Éowyn) it is both grossly overwrought, and nonsensical.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

Of course you were bothered by it. But there was nothing "pseudo-Shakespearean" about it. I thought it did a wonderful job at showing just how creepy Grima could be, turning words of comfort into a threat.

[Passdagas the Brown]

Well, it's certainly not the worst cut-and-paste line from PBJ, and I don't think I dislike it as much as Dave. At least Tolkien's language is in there, and it is quite beautiful ("morning of pale spring still clinging to winter chill, etc")

I just find that coming from the Wormtongue PJ gave us, and the half-baked Grima-Éowyn storyline he presented us, that it felt quite unnatural and perfunctory.

I suppose it was threatening, but what exactly was the threat? And why exactly was he threatening her at this time? Shouldn't he be trying to avoid suspicion that he is either responsible for Theodred's death, or uncaring about it?

I understand that the scene is successful in presenting us with a really creepy guy, who makes threats out of compliments, but in the context of PJ's thin story-telling on this subplot, it feels overwrought. As if PJ is trying very hard to imitate Shakespeare, while leaving out all the complexity.

[Primula Baggins]

This discussion of Grima's borrowed line is odd. I have always thought that it was an excellent use of Tolkien's words. I didn't see anything perfunctory about it—it helped me see how intensely he wanted Éowyn for himself. That lust was inherently a threat to a woman so isolated, whether or not the words themselves contained a threat. I found it chilling, and clearly so did Éowyn.

[Elentári]

So the US Gift set is open for pre-order now!




The listing for the French version of this set seems to confirm that the High Fells scene is the DoS preview featured on the discs:

http://www.amazon.fr/The-Hobbit-An-Unex ... B00E9CWSIM




Still no news of a UK gift set yet, other than the mysterious Premium Bilbo's Trunk Blu-Ray Edition

[Jude]

What is the "Ultra-Violet" format they've been advertising? Is that the new high frame rate?