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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2012 7:32 pm 
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I always had the impression from LotR that authority was bound by race, not territory, exactly—an Elven King ruled Elves, a king of Men ruled Men, etc. Of course that could just be a false impression left by the fact that Middle-earth is (conveniently?) large enough that at the time of LotR, areas occupied by the various races don't really overlap; there are wide open spaces in between. The Shire is the only exception I can think of, traditionally and then, by the end of the story, actually owing fealty to a king of Men.

Thranduil actually acknowledging Thror as an overlord would upset that for me. Yet in the film it didn't occur to me to think that was what was being shown.

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― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2012 8:09 pm 
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If that was the case, then Thorin would have a much bigger complaint than the lack of help - an omission, so to speak. Thranduil would be breaking an oath of allegiance, really a despicable act. But that didn't seem to be Thorin's point.

In a case of fans ruining a movie moment for me, someone on TORC remarked that Thranduil looked like a lovechild of Lucius Malfoy and Leonid Brezhnev, and now I'm unable to look at him without laughing.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 11:11 pm 
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Here's some pleasant reading (not):

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/frank-sch ... 60368.html

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:39 am 
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My RL family and friends who have seen it -- which is just about everyone I know -- have said they really liked it. Everyone is surprised I haven't seen it yet since none of them is as big a Tolkien fan as me. Most of them loved Jackson's LOTR, some have even read the books, and I read The Hobbit to my children when they were very young.

eta: Most have seen it in 2D.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 1:03 am 
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Forgive me if yiou have already explained this, but I never got it. Why exactly have you avoided seeing it? Because you are mad at Jackson because of the labor dispute? Or some other reason?

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 1:32 am 
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Voronwë the Faithful wrote:
Forgive me if yiou have already explained this, but I never got it. Why exactly have you avoided seeing it? Because you are mad at Jackson because of the labor dispute? Or some other reason?

I'm not so much mad at him, though as the "de facto interpreter of Tolkien in the new millennium" (as I called him elsewhere) and public face of this thing, I wish he would have spoken up and/or dug his heels in over more than just the uninviting of the NZRadio journalist. My not wanting to see (especially pay to see) TH is because of the way WB treated NZ all along.

However, I am happy to continue speaking about The Hobbit and related topics with my friends here and elsewhere, if they will have me.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 2:12 am 
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And we are happy to do so with you. I respect your decision, even if I would not make the same one.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 4:03 am 
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Just to play devil's advocate, however (it's a bit of an occupational hazard), who are you punishing more, WB, or yourself?

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 5:06 am 
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Voronwë the Faithful wrote:
Just to play devil's advocate, however (it's a bit of an occupational hazard), who are you punishing more, WB, or yourself?

Hmmm well I'm not sure they will miss my 10 dollars so clearly it isn't them. However I feel strongly enough about the things that have disappointed me that I would actually be punishing myself if I paid to see the movie. Part of it too is somewhere along the way I realized that I had made an idol of the LOTR movies and people, images and objects associated with the movies. It's enough to say I think, that the way I feel about the movies is "complicated." :bang:


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 5:13 am 
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Lordy, Sir D....go see the blasted movie already.

I'll send you 10 bucks.

:D

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 5:18 am 
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I haven't seen it and don't plan to... it's not about punishing anyone, it's just about not wanting to sit through something that will likely make me feel ill.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 5:37 am 
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Jewel :rofl:

Hal, yes something like that though for different reasons I think.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 3:51 pm 
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Hal, I have to tell you that the first time I saw it, I thought about you a couple of times. I thought, "Hal would hate this!"

I loved it though and plan to see it again in HFR. :D

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 4:48 pm 
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Heh, I'm sure you were right too :)

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 5:18 pm 
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You can be a kind of Wildwood for us. Since Wildwood has seen the Hobbit. :D

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― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 5:45 pm 
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And mostly loved it.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 12:49 am 
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It's interesting how, on one hand, Jackson gets a lot of flak from some Tolkien fans for overdoing the action (which I agree with in certain scenes, but I think it's sometimes exaggerrated). And then on the other hand, non-fans will sometimes criticize him for "too many dwarf songs" or "too much walking."

PJ obviously loves big action scenes, but I think he very much likes slower character-oriented ones too (in fact, his favorite scene in each LotR movie falls in that category). Because he wants a good amount of both in his movies, they are rather long and sometimes unwieldy, but generally enjoyable I think. At least LotR/Hobbit - haven't seen anything else.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 1:29 am 
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kzer_za wrote:
PJ obviously loves big action scenes, but I think he very much likes slower character-oriented ones too (in fact, his favorite scene in each LotR movie falls in that category). Because he wants a good amount of both in his movies, they are rather long and sometimes unwieldy, but generally enjoyable I think.

This is an apt description of King Kong, and why I loved that movie. In fact once they got off the boat (a good hour into the movie), I pretty much lost interest until they were back in New York... except for some of the scenes with Watts and Kong.

As a side note, (as I've said before elsewhere) I really think the first hour of King Kong -- if not the whole movie -- is an autobiographical sketch of Jackson's experience making LOTR.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 2:08 am 
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Dennis, for Eru's sake, go see this movie. :hug:

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 8:49 pm 
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Nice article by Michael Martinez (are you out there, Michael?) about Richard Armitage and Thorin, which I largely agree with:

On Peter Jackson’s “Hobbit” – Richard Armitage Defines Thorin Oakenshield

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