Cast Speculation

[Jnyusa]

[Note: I split this off from the del Toro thread - VtF]

An interview with del Toro is supposed to come out in Empire magazine tomorrow. http://www.empireonline.com/magazine/

Of casting Bilbo, del Toro says:

"I can tell you that it’s down to a few names that we all agree upon. And that our first choice…completely, magically, we said the same name. All of us!"

Who's up for a guessing game?

If you say "Bilbo," who would simultaneously leap into the minds of del Toro, Jackson, Walsh, and Boyens? (And will that person have to learn their part phonetically?)

[Primula Baggins]

Nobody leaps to my mind, certainly.

The actor has to be:

1. English. All the other hobbits have been speakers of British English, which is what suits the Shire; and Bilbo in LotR speaks English English, if I may be technical. The American hobbits did a great job learning their accents, but there are some audible "slips."

2. Someone who, in both bone structure and voice, could reasonably age into Ian Holm.

3. Short—in the 5'3" to 5'6" range they kept to for the other major hobbits. This was important for scale in the LotR films—much taller and they would not have been able to find real people who were tall enough to be "Men" in the correct size ratio. Props, sets, etc. were all built to that scale. Still more important, if they can cast the dwarves using men who are a bit on the tall side, the size differential between dwarves and hobbits will be right with no need for scale tricks—which will save them a lot of time and trouble.

4. A good actor, if del Toro and PJ both thought of him. (Whatever his sins, I think PJ did a brilliant job of casting LotR.)

Quick, somebody search IMDB.

(Actually, if I had to pick someone who fits 2 and 4, though neither of the others, I'd pick the actor who plays Wilson on House. His voice is even right, a light tenor—just not the accent.)

[Jnyusa]

That's Robert Sean Leonard. You know who he is? He played the young man who commits suicide in Dead Poet's Society. I sat through whole season of House trying to remember what movie I knew him from! This his first notable role since Dead Poets, I believe, though he seems to have worked steadily since then on movies that didn't rise far above the radar.

He's pretty tall, you know.

How about his co-star in Dead Poets - Ethan Hawke.

del Toro seems to use the same people over and over, and lots of European actors because so many of his films are in Spanish. I'm wondering if they are looking at people we've never heard of over here.


or ... ohm'gosh ... Hugh Laurie?

[Primula Baggins]

Oh, yes, I know he's too tall—that's why I said he met 2 and 4. I just think there's something of Ian Holm about his bone structure and his voice. And I like him (I just now tonight wept through the season finale of House, which has been languishing on the DVR).

But you may be onto something. Wasn't Ethan Hawke under serious consideration for LotR? Him and his then-wife Uma Thurman, for Celeborn and Galadriel? Or am I crazy?

Hugh Laurie? Nah, too tall. Too sour. Too pop-eyed (though I like him just fine; brains above all). He might have made a nice Elrond, but not a beautiful one.



Edit because I spell "Ian" wrong every time now after writing two and a half novels about an "Iain"

[Jnyusa]

Yeah, too old too, now that I think about it. They cast Frodo a lot younger than he was in the book, and I'm sure they'll do the same for Bilbo. Given the PG13 rating, the target audience is a lot younger than 50.

[Alatar]

Martin Freeman, most recently of The Office (Original UK Version) and The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy.

The only problem is he's almost TOO obvious! I mean, Arthur Dent practically is Bilbo.

[Alatar]

This just in...

There's a bunch of sites reporting this, so I'm gonna post the link to the first site to have reported this (chronologically according to google)... the article is here on ShowbizSpy.

The relevant excerpt states:

A source tells British newspaper the Daily Express, "A number of names have been doing the rounds, including Daniel Radcliffe and Jack Black, but James (McAvoy) is the one the film's bosses really want.

"They're expected to have talks soon so hopefully it could be confirmed in the not too distant future."

Personally I can't see the other two as realistic, but James McAvoy would be a serious contender.

[solicitr]

I believe that back when, PJ was considering Ethan Hawke and Uma Thurman for Faramir and Éowyn.

I think Miranda was a much better choice.

Myself, I still like Ricky Gervase as Bilbo.

[WampusCat]

I almost mentioned James McAvoy! Then I looked again at his photo and decided he didn't look enough like Ian Holm. But he certainly could do the part justice.

I considered Daniel Ratcliffe as well, but he's ... well, he's Harry Potter, not Bilbo.

Not Jack Black. Please, please not Jack Black. I like him in some roles, but not this one. Please.

[solicitr]

Isn't McAvoy a bit young for Bilbo?

[Primula Baggins]

They'll probably do the reasoning they did for casting Frodo, where hobbit 33 is human 21—so hobbit 50 could be early 30s. I see McAvoy is 29 now.

Daniel Radcliffe is WAY too young and way too identifiable and looks nothing like Iain Holm. And not the level of actor they want, I really don't think, much as I enjoy the Harry Potter movies.

Jack Black! Good God!

James McAvoy would probably do.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

Yeah, too old too, now that I think about it. They cast Frodo a lot younger than he was in the book, and I'm sure they'll do the same for Bilbo. Given the PG13 rating, the target audience is a lot younger than 50.

Here we go again.

They actually cast Frodo just about right, in terms of looks. Although he was fifty, because of the Ring he retained the looks of a hobbit just out of his tweens. In other words, the equivalent in a human of someone in his early twenties, at most. In other words, Elijah Wood's age when they made the films.

As for Bilbo, since he was also fifty, but had not had the influence of the Ring, he should look older than Frodo, but not as old as a fifty-year old human, since hobbits age slower than humans. I would say that an actor in his mid- to late-30s would be perfect. James McAvoy at 29 is a bit too young, but probably could work.

[WampusCat]

I'm thinking Alatar might be a fine Bilbo, especially if they let him sing.

[River]

Jack Black as Bilbo...

That had to be a joke. Please, tell me that was a joke.

[Primula Baggins]

They could be boxing us a bit by naming two actors who'd be widely objected to—then when they reveal who it actually is, our first reactions are more likely to be, "Oh, thank God!"

I Googled some images of MacAvoy, and in a Regency short curly wig he does look hobbity.

[Jnyusa]

IMDB Slideshows:


Martin Freeman

James McAvoy

Jack Black

[Primula Baggins]

Martin Freeman looks perfect. And his IMDB entry says he's 5' 7", which probably means he's 5' 5".

James MacAvoy looks almost as right—a little young. And he is also 5' 7", officially.

I didn't look at Jack Black. He could play a hobbit, a somewhat depraved one—Bilbo's cousin nobody mentions—but please, not Bilbo himself.

[solicitr]

Here we go again.

They actually cast Frodo just about right, in terms of looks. Although he was fifty, because of the Ring he retained the looks of a hobbit just out of his tweens. In other words, the equivalent in a human of someone in his early twenties, at most. In other words, Elijah Wood's age when they made the films.

Sorry, V. You're wrong, wrong, wrong.

Hobbits do *not* mature any more slowly than Men. The 33 business was another of JRRT's sly Shire jokes- don't you get it? The man who spent his life dealing with college students was opining that in any sensible, well-ordered society young people in their 'tweens' ought never to be considered legally responsible adults.


If I have to back up my long-held view with the voice of Authority, here goes: CJRT, who was boggled, perplexed, outraged by PJ's decision to cast a teenager as Frodo, says 'fifty is fifty.' For men and hobbits both.

In other words, McAvoy is about the right age to play Frodo (properly cast).


(The other angle: Ian Holm as he appeared in the brief FR Gollum sequence might have passed for 50, but certainly not 30!)

[solicitr]

Jack Black has already played Frodo......

[Primula Baggins]

So he has. I haven't looked at that Easter Egg in a while.

That must be where I got "depraved."

As for Film Frodo, I had the impression that the screenplay eliminates the 17-year gap between Frodo at 33 learning that the Ring is dangerous, and Frodo at 50 finally doing something about it; that gap in the film is a year at most (assuming the Party is September 22, and given that it's early fall when they leave the Shire). So Film Frodo is supposedly about 33, just of age.

I defer to Christopher Tolkien's knowledge, of course. But I always thought, even before the films were imagined, that Hobbits did not reach real maturity until 33 and that the "tweens" were physically equivalent to human "teens." After all, they do live quite a bit longer, so it always made sense to me that they might grow up more slowly.