Listening to ROTK: A Storm is Coming

For discussion of the upcoming films based on The Hobbit and related material, as well as previous films based on Tolkien's work
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TheTennisBallKid
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Post by TheTennisBallKid »

As Voronwë said, they're working on the other two...possibly within the next year, but maybe two years so they can space them out a little and not overflood the market. FOTR is selling very well. :) Here it is at Amazon, for anyone interested.
I definitely think that these soundtracks were a hugely incredible achievement (at least equal to the films themselves, although of course it is impossible to separate the visuals from the music.
It's probably no suprise that I agree. :P It's a testament both to Shore's ability as an artist, and the incredible opportunity PJ gave him...three years to write a twelve hour score for an epic fantasy is a dream job, really unheard of. And...I won't osgiliate into a discussion of King Kong. *muttermutter* :P

And, Voronwë, thank you. It's extremely gratifying to know that people are reading. :) And I can't wait for ROTK, then. :D ;)



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Post by truehobbit »

I don't know why I never did that before, but I just listened to the first four tracks on the CD while reading your analyses of them, and that was quite fascinating! :love:
Thanks for keeping this up - I guess I'll go on TORC and do the same with FOTR as soon as possible! :D
but being a cheerful hobbit he had not needed hope, as long as despair could be postponed.
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Post by TheTennisBallKid »

Hello, Hobby! :wave:


The Uruk-hai opens with horn calls, playing the first half of the Fellowship theme -- or, the Fellowship Prelude -- with light percussion underneath, as the Three Hunters are introduced. A brass heavy, heroic statement of the full theme follows, over the long shots of them running through the countryside. The theme is passed through the woodwinds as Aragorn finds Merry's brooch; and then finally, it plays on strings as they continue their hunt. It quiets for a moment, then as they reach the borders...the Rohan theme's first phrase is played on brass (and echoed by the strings).

In the film, this cue plays a large part in the scene; giving it a rythmic drive, it urges them on with the ever-present percussion and a repeating brass figure. It also reintroduces us to the Fellowship theme, which is not quite forlorn as when we last heard it, at the end of FOTR, but the emphasis on brass gives it a harsher edge.

The Rohan theme gets it's theatrical introduction here, a partial statement on the brass, which holds the last note, drowning out the string counterpoint. (an effect lessened in the film because of a slightly different mix)

Apart from the film, this is interesting just because of how much time Shore gets to develop and variate the theme here; at a full minute and a half, this would be the good basis for a concert arrangement. It's also insanely hummable...dun, dun, da da dun, da da dun, da da dun, da da dun, da da dun! :D

The second half of the track flows closely on the heels of the opening, chronologically. It features the Isengard percussion before moving into a swirling rhaita solo of the Mordor/Sauron theme which crescendos, then moves into a rather straight-forward, but strong, rendition of the Isengard theme.

Truncated a bit from what is heard in the film, but still notable for vigorous statements of the main evil themes.


The track as a whole is part of a larger sequence, an overture of sorts, in the film, that introduces the storylines for the rest of the Fellowship. Highlights of the unreleased music from this sequence would include a heroic passage as Merry loses his brooch; the music heard as the Rohirrim ride back to Edoras with Theodred; the elegaic choir as the Westfold is burnt (Old English choir is a device used to identify with the plight of Rohan throughout); and the magnificent intertwining of the choral piece from Boromir's last stand, the Isengard percussion, and horn statements of the Fellowship theme as the Three Hunters continue their pursuit. The latter two are at Hirgon's LOTR Music site, "The Burning Of The Westfold" has quite a bit of background noise still present though.


*********************
On a related note, some unreleased music from ROTK has surfaced in the "Battle For Middle Earth2" video game demo, and in particular, I have an MP3 of the music from when the Rohirrm arrive at Minas Tirith that I'm willing to share...so, PM me. ;)



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Post by Cerin »

ttbk, this commentary of yours is so helpful in appreciating the music! :)

Following along with your description, I had always taken the 'Fellowship theme' to be Aragorn's music.

I couldn't find 'rhaita' in my dictionaries. Could you elaborate?
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Post by TheTennisBallKid »

Following along with your description, I had always taken the 'Fellowship theme' to be Aragorn's music.
Not completely unfounded, as it's quite often used in association with him. However, there is a more specfic theme just for him, which I'll touch on at some point...
I couldn't find 'rhaita' in my dictionaries. Could you elaborate?
Sure. It's a rather rare (to the point that most of the references I can find for it are related to it's use in LOTR) African double-reed instrument, similar to an oboe. It's mainly used as a solo instrument for the Mordor/Sauron theme.

Image


:)
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Post by Cerin »

Ah, thanks!

It certainly produces an appropriately snarky sound. :D
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Post by TheTennisBallKid »

Hello again! :wave:


[0:00]The King of the Golden Hall opens with the Fellowship Prelude on horns as Gandalf and the Three Hunters approach Edoras. [0:07]A hardanger fiddle plays the first phrase of the Rohan theme, which is followed by a descending horn passage, then a slow statement of the theme on horns as we see the king in decline. [0:24]Éowyn's theme is given a wistful statement by woodwinds, then strings, as she shakes off Grima's advances, and goes outside.[0:54] The Rohan theme is given a melancholy rendering by the hardanger, then a fuller orchestral version as the camera pans over the city, horns wind the theme down. [1:50]An ominous bass line is introduced, the strings hold a note, then a rising and falling rythmic brass motif enters as Gandalf and co. cross the hall, it quiets into an uneasy passage with swirling strings that reaches an abrupt halt.[2:32]Horns and strings begin an elagic passage as Théoden mourns the loss of his son, an oboe joins the melody at [2:50], and then a gentle, rising Old English choir comes in, the track ends with a choral "aaah" as Gndalf sees the two children arrive on the horse.

The lrics are from The Fallen, written by Philippa Boyens. The lines that are used in the score are in bold:
Hé laered hine rídan He taught him to ride,
And wealdan méce To wield a sword.
And standan fæst To stand strong
And féond ne forhtian. And show his enemy no fear.
Nú hé sceal leornian Now he must learn
Ðæt hearde sóð: The hard truth:
Hé raerede his cnapa That he had brought his boy
Of cilde tó menn From childhood.
Ðæt hé his déað geséo. So that he might face his death like a man.


Sé féond wæs simble mid heom. The enemy was always with them.
Sé féond ne reccede ege. The enemy did not care about fear.
And time stamps, from Magpie's Nest:

Code: Select all

 [02:58] Of
[03:02] cilde
[03:06] tó
[03:07] menn
[03:11] Ðæt
[03:15] hé
[03:17] his
[03:19] déað
[03:23] ge-
[03:25] sé
[03:27] o.
Most interesting here is the use of the hardanger fiddle, a Norwegian instrument which gives Rohan's music a distinct rustic feel. It can be used to give emotional weight to their tragedy, as is shown here; but as heard in The Rider's of Rohan, it also gives them a nobility that a simple brass and strings fanfare would not have.

Éowyn's theme gets it's first full statement in the film here, it's a forceful entry for the beautiful melody, and combined with the fiddle solo as the flag tears away, one of the most memorable uses of music in the trilogy(IMO), one of those scenes I find delightful, just because the music carries so much of them. I like that. :)

Not a great deal to say about the middle section, I enjoy the music as the Three Hunters ensure Gandalf's safe passage through the hall a great deal though...

The last cue, as Théoden mourns, is the first time Old English(Rohhirric) appears on the album, but it is used in association with Rohan throughout the film.


All this music is from one lengthy sequence in the film, one that is nearly completely represented on the CD; The Riders Of Rohan, and The White Rider contain additional music from it. Given the suite like nature of much of the CD, not intended to be a chronological reresentation, this doesn't bother me that much, but I do think it would have made more sense for the music after Théoden is freed to be heard after the music in this track. In order to let the theme develop in the course of listening...



TTBK
Glowah, eee chop glowah.
Ya glowah pee chu nee foom
Ah toot dee awe goon daa.

Glory, we found glory.
The power showed us the light,
And now we all live free.

Celebrate the light; (Freedom!)
Celebrate the might; (Power!)
Celebrate the fight; (Glory!)
Celebrate the love.
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Post by TheTennisBallKid »

After a longer than intended pause, we continue!

This track covers the sequence where Frodo, Sam, and Gollum arrive at the Black Gates.

[0:00]Rising horns and strings lead into a rhaita statement of the begining of the Mordor theme as they see the Gates.[0:12]The theme is continued on strings, and the bass plays the skip-beat ostinato[1] underneath.[0:24]The Mordor theme is stated in full as the scene cuts to the orcs atop the gate. It is picked up by the low brass as the camera returns to the hobbits, who are awed by the front door of Mordor. A mounting horn and percussion phrase follows as the Easterlings appear, the gate opens, and the tension increases as Sam decides that this is their chance.[1:11]There is a pause, then a short rythmic passage that ends as he falls...

Jumping head in the action...

[1:24]High strings lead into first the Pity of Gollum theme, then the Ring theme, as Gollum tries to convince them that there is another way.[1:49]An ascending woodwind phrase leads into darker strings as Frodo tries to decide whether to believe him.[2:07]The Pity of Gollum is given a slow, airy statement by the strings, with the skip beat ostinato reappearing underneath on the bass.[2:39]The theme winds down, and a solemn horn solo underscores the tension, as he has decided to follow Gollum, and Sam can't believe it.


Thematically, the interesting part of this track is the way Shore inertwines the Sméagol/History of the Ring themes, throughout TTT the already closely linked themes come closer together, due to their shared history...


:wave:
TTBK
[1] The skip beat ostinato is one the short danger motifs associated with the forces of evil, it is a rapid, repetitive, ascending phrase of 4 notes.
Glowah, eee chop glowah.
Ya glowah pee chu nee foom
Ah toot dee awe goon daa.

Glory, we found glory.
The power showed us the light,
And now we all live free.

Celebrate the light; (Freedom!)
Celebrate the might; (Power!)
Celebrate the fight; (Glory!)
Celebrate the love.
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

Éowyn's theme gets it's first full statement in the film here, it's a forceful entry for the beautiful melody, and combined with the fiddle solo as the flag tears away, one of the most memorable uses of music in the trilogy(IMO)
Yes, I would agree. Not just because the music is so beautiful and haunting, but because it is so meaningful. Just an absolutely wonderful example of how music and imagery can be used together to produce such powerful emotions. There are (in my extremely humble and relatively unexperienced opinion) very few scenes in any film (not just the LOTR trilogy) that do it as well as this one.
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
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Post by Primula Baggins »

I just listened to the last two tracks you discussed, ttbk, while reading along in your post.

What a brilliant choice the Hardanger fiddle was! The harshness in the tone makes it sound old, from another time, and yet it's beautiful. And the passage scoring the scene where the flag tears loose and flies out to land at Aragorn's feet, essentially: I love the way visuals and music work together throughout the films, but this is one of the greatest examples. Visually, musically, emotionally, symbolically, it all works together.

I need to watch (and listen to) the films again very soon. Thanks for opening the door a bit to this relatively oblivious viewer. Thanks to you I'm learning to identify the important themes, the use of which I know underscores the meaning of many scenes.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
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Post by TheTennisBallKid »

Voronwë_the_Faithful wrote:There are (in my extremely humble and relatively unexperienced opinion) very few scenes in any film (not just the LOTR trilogy) that do it as well as this one.
It's a wonderful scene :) ...just today I was thinking about how similar it is to another scene that I think works just as well...

Image
Image
Both have young and restless characters walking out of the home they feel caged in by, accompanied by their own theme on strings, then they gaze out to the horizon, and a solo instrument begins the theme that symbolizes what their hopes will hinge upon (for Luke, it is the Force; for Éowyn, it is Rohan, and it's coming revival...), and the orchestra gradually swells...


Just thinking out loud... :)



Prim, :hug: I'm glad to be able to share what knowledge and passion I have for this...


And, just because I can, an old M00bies quote..
Eli_Cash wrote:Shore's music is the best thing about the films.

And yes, that's like, my opinion, dude.
:D :D :D



ttbk
Glowah, eee chop glowah.
Ya glowah pee chu nee foom
Ah toot dee awe goon daa.

Glory, we found glory.
The power showed us the light,
And now we all live free.

Celebrate the light; (Freedom!)
Celebrate the might; (Power!)
Celebrate the fight; (Glory!)
Celebrate the love.
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

Yes, that is a great example, ttbk (indeed I recall someone, I believe Gandalf's Mother, pointing to that scene as an example of the type of thing that they missed in the LOTR films).
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
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Post by Primula Baggins »

That scene from Star Wars is unforgettable, and precisely because of the way the gorgeous music supports the visuals and the emotion. Star Wars was the first film I ever saw in which the score just electrified me (I was 18 years old). I had never heard anything like it, because even older films scored that way didn't have the advantage of marvelous sound (and because Star Wars spoke to me as a lifelong science fiction fan—it was the first SF film I ever saw that had a real, used, lived-in-looking setting, instead of looking as if the last coat of paint on the set had just dried and everyone's clothes were fresh from the cleaners).

After that, though I appreciated many scores, I was never electrified again until LotR. The equivalent of the Tatooine sunset appears many times in those films, whereas the Star Wars films only achieved that for me twice more. The first was in Jedi, where Vader says, "If you will not turn to the dark side, perhaps she will"—and Luke yells "No! and attacks, and the choral music kicks in. :love: The choral music that was NOT ON THE SCORE ALBUM. :x The second was in Sith, where Anakin and Padme are each in a tower looking out toward each other as the late afternoon draws on, and Anakin is slowly making a terrible choice. The sad, contemplative music created the depth of emotion in that scene.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
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Post by vison »

*sigh*

This is so over my head.

But I like it. :)
Dig deeper.
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Post by MaidenOfTheShieldarm »

Me, too, Vison.

I'm not entirely sure what to say here, so these are just a few thoughts.

I don't know or recognise most of the themes, so your commentary about the intertwining of the Sméagol/Ring themes was particularly interesting. Shore's choice to use it there in particular is telling in regards to Gollum's motives there. His fate and the fate of the Ring . . . the two themes put together: he wants to keep the Ring close to himself as long as possible, to save it. I love the way Shore uses the strings. One generally things of them as light and more airy (especially violins), but they're so dark and foreboding in most of this. Kind of like the Ring itself, I suppose. Pretty and shiny, but really rather evil.

And that's all I've got. Except that there was something else, but I can't remember what. :scratch:
And it is said by the Eldar that in the water there lives yet the echo of the Music of the Ainur more than in any substance else that is in this Earth; and many of the Children of Ilúvatar hearken still unsated to the voices of the sea, and yet know not what for what they listen.
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Post by TheTennisBallKid »

Vison, I'm honored to know that you're reading. :D

*would love to hear whatever it was that Mossi forgot if she remembers*

*************
Hello again! :)

[0:00]Isabel Bayrakdarian sings the Evenstar theme, back by female choir and gentle strings, as Arwen stands by Aragorn's tomb in Minas Tirith.
Ú i vethed nâ i onnad. Not the end [it] is the beginning.
Si boe ú-dhanna. Now it-is-necessary [that] don't-fall
Ae ú-esteli, esteliach nad If you trust some-thing, trust this.
[0:32]A gentle oboe reading of Aragorn's theme as we move to Aragorn and Arwen in Rivendell.[0:47]Choir joins:
Nâ boe ú i. [It] is necessary don't that.
[1:04]Horn and string variation on the Evenstar theme, as Arwen tells him that his path is with Frodo.[1:34]Aragorn's theme returns on the woodwinds.[1:58]The Evenstar theme returns for choir and soloist as they kiss.
Estelio han, estelio han, estelio,
estelio han, estelio veleth. Trust this, trust love.
[2:30]The Evenstar variant from 1:04 returns as Aragorn tries to give the Evenstar back.The track winds down as Aragorn tells Éowyn where the woman who gave him the jewel is...

Here the beautiful Evenstar theme (the Evenstar referenced in the title is Arwen Undomiel; not the jewel) is introduced.In the film, it is first used at the begining of the Arwen/Aragorn sequence in Rivendell, but the CD track features a rendition from the "Arwen's Fate" scene; which is slighter longer, and has a more prominent solo vocal.

The Evenstar theme is used in conjunction with Arwen in general, and specifically, with her decision to choose a mortal life, and a mortal man. It is related to 'Anrion' from FOTR, but with a much more tragic sense to it.

The lyrics come from Phillipa Boyens poem 'Evenstar', which has it's base in Arwen's lines:
Ú i vethed...nâ i onnad. Boe bedich go Frodo. Han bâd lîn. Si peliannen i vâd na dail lîn. Si boe ú-dhannathach. Ae ú-esteliach nad... estelio han. Estelio ammen.

This is not the end. It is the beginning. You must go with Frodo. That is your path. It is already laid before your feet, you cannot falter now. If you trust nothing else, trust this.[ the Evenstar jewel] Trust us.
The other theme referenced here is Aragorn's theme (or: The Heroics Of Aragorn); a theme connected to his evolution from Ranger to King; it is a rather elusive idea throughout FOTR, slowly developing from some ascending notes in the Prancing Pony, to a brass fanfare at Weathertop, to a more fully formed themeatic idea, finally, at Amon Hen. It's most distinctive feature is its three(?) ascending notes. It will appear on the TTT album a couple more times (Breath Of Life, Isengard Unleashed), and in ROTK will be linked to the Gondor theme...

Here it is given a unique, gentle reading by the woodwinds as Arwen urges him onto his path to being a leader of men.



All together, this is a very beautiful track, and a fitting accompaniment to this love story....


ttbk

Lyrics from: Magpie's nest
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Post by Lacemaker »

I really love this track. Somehow "track" sounds wrong for this wonderful music... It is lovely on its own; it took my breath away in the Arwen's fate section of the film. Such poignant beauty filling our ears, our eyes, our hearts... sigh...
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Post by Cerin »

I find the solo to be so beautiful and ethereal. I don't quite know what it is about the quality of the voice. It seems like a dark, rich voice to me but it also sounds clear, which I think is a contradiction in terms. It has a beautiful sonority (which has always been one of the most appealing characteristic of voices, for me).
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Post by TheTennisBallKid »

Lacey!! :D hi. :)

Cerin, I love it too... :)

**********************

:D

The first half of this track is taken from Gandalf's exorcism of Théoden.

[0:00}A deep string chord, as Gandalf flings off back his cloak and reveals himself to be Gandalf the White.[0:03]Mixed choir and brass issue the same challenge he gave to the balrog: " Mettanna!(To the end!)"[0:13]The choir, in Old English(Rohhiric):

Code: Select all

Lim-strang wæs geboren
Bearn inga
Magorinc 
 in byrde 
An extract from The King. On the CD it's edited down by about ten seconds, what is heard in the film is in bold below:
Lim-strang wæs geboren Strong-limbed he was born
Bearn léod-cyninga This son of Kings;
Magorinc Mearces. This warrior of Rohan.
Bunden in byrde tó laedenne Bound by birth to lead.
Bunden in lufe tó ðegnunge Bound by love to serve.
Lang beadugear cýðað Long years of war begin to show.
Lic onginneð búgan. The body has begun to bend.
Swift déadlic géar Stieppað geond willan. Swift mortal years outpace the will.
Ac éagan gíet lóciað Beorhtre gesihðe; But the eyes still watch clear-sighted.
Heorte gíet béateð. The great heart is beating still.'
So it is about Théoden, whose life the wizards are contending over.

The underscore during all this is just as, if not more, interesting. The Isengard percussion beat is heard, and also a brass passage that illustrates the genius of Shore's Isengard and White Rider themes. In a musical effect similar to the mixing of Lee's and McKellen's voices in Fangorn, Shore leaves it open to interpretation whether he is using one theme, or the other. Or both. Just as Gandalf is Sauruman as he should have been, the White Rider theme is the Isengard theme as it should have been. Both open with the same three notes, after that they're structure is slightly different; 'Isengard' pauses briefly, then there are three more ascending notes; 'White Rider' adds a fourth note, which becomes the first note of another four notes...
(I didn't realize all this completely till just now. I, too, am learning...)

'Tis touches such as this that let me appreciate these scores on levels intellectual, as well as visceral.

The second half is from after Gandalf's return, and Shadowfax's first appearance.

[0:40]Gentle string arpeggios, he has come back, at the turn of the tide.[1:02]Horn fanfare as he whistles for his steed.[1:15]Female choir(till 1:44), then male choir, over more string arpeggios sing:

Code: Select all

 for  ðon hé waes Sceadufæx  	for he was Shadowfax,
hláford ealra méara 	Lord of all Horses.
From The Mearas.

[2:00]The White Rider theme makes its first appearance in the score, and is magnificently stated by brass and strings as Gandalf and the Three Hunters make their way over the plains of Rohan.

The piece from 1:02 to 2:00 is an alternate, and is not used in the film. The film version (which Hirgon has) has horns rather than strings, and places a greater emphasis on the male voices.

To sync the whole piece from :40 onward with the film, you have to start it at about 45:19 into the TE DVD, it fits perfectly. If someone just has the EEs, I can figure out how to do it for just Shadowfax's appearance, but it's trickier...


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Post by TheTennisBallKid »

:wave:


We'll start listening to this track at 0:54, and then go back to the start. ;)

This section of music was intended for Merry and Pippin's initial encounter with Treebeard, but only 1:37 onward was used, the emphasis being on the sound effects in this scene. It can be synced to the film by starting the EE DVD Disc 1 (region 1) at about 39:59, "Tree? I am no tree..."

On to the music...

[0:54]Fangorn's signature sound -- wandering bassoon melodies, over bass marimbas, double-bass, , and woodblock percussion -- plays as Treebeard challenges the assertion that he is a tree. It is not hasty, but it is deliberate...but not neccessarily sure it is going to go anywhere. The forest is not awake yet...

[1:44]The music takes a threatening turn as Treebeard repeats his accusation that they're orcs, and squeezes them. The more lighthearted marimba disappears, and the bassoon and bass percussion continue to plod.[2:10]A tense note is held while the percussion continues as Treebeard decides to bring them before the White Wizard...[2:17]....high strings enter and the percussion builds to a roll as they are dropped before him.

This cue introduces Fangorn's sound, no real specific motif, just an atmosphere that uses mostly wooden instruments to give it a natural feel. The section from 1:44 on gives us a sense of the strength of the place and its keepers, but not a clear sign that Merry and Pippin are about to start an avalanche. (though that has been hinted at in the unreleased clarinet rendition of the Nature theme heard a few minutes earlier)

[0:00]Meandering bassoon as Treebeard and hobbits arrive at the Ent Moot.[0:14]The other ents have arrived; mixed choir sings: echuia, holding it till 0:33.[0:27]A drum roll.[0:36] "Now we must decide if the Ents will go to war." An aleatory string phrase that leads to....(choir enters at :47 with nnen, and holds it till...)[0:53]A crescendo.

More of the Fangorn sound, but with choir, which sings (in a very unhasty manner):
...echuiannen ... have awoken
From the Sindarin poem The Ents, which was excerpted earlier in the film as Gandalf told the Three Hunters that Fangorn would wake up, and will return in Isengard Unleashed.


As one last side note, 2:17-2:36 was tracked over Gandalf's appearance; a sequence which features the most jumbled combination of original music, tracked music, and unused music in the entire trilogy....



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Resources: Magpie's Nest: Treebeard
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