Battlestar Galactica: SPOILERS for season 4
- Primula Baggins
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Battlestar Galactica: SPOILERS for season 4
Okay, because my kids have the TV for a party, I have not yet seen the season 4 premiere.
Nevertheless. Those of you who have been watching this incredible series know what I mean when I say that those of you who have not been watching this incredible series have been missing some of the best television drama ever made. The writing is almost cruelly incisive and true, but also deeply moving. The people are real. Even if you are sure you hate SF, you have no idea what this show has to offer.
Discuss, with season 4 spoilers. Nonspoiler discussion continues in the "TV Obsessions" thread.
Nevertheless. Those of you who have been watching this incredible series know what I mean when I say that those of you who have not been watching this incredible series have been missing some of the best television drama ever made. The writing is almost cruelly incisive and true, but also deeply moving. The people are real. Even if you are sure you hate SF, you have no idea what this show has to offer.
Discuss, with season 4 spoilers. Nonspoiler discussion continues in the "TV Obsessions" thread.
Last edited by Primula Baggins on Thu Apr 24, 2008 1:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
I hate this.
I really do.
I hate having to avoid these threads for the 2 weeks it takes for the eps to get to Ireland. I know, I know, there's nothing that can be done, and you can't ask people to hold off discussing for 2 weeks, cause maybe Eastern Europe gets it in 4 weeks, and Australia in 6 or whatever.
I just hate it.
Carry on.
I really do.
I hate having to avoid these threads for the 2 weeks it takes for the eps to get to Ireland. I know, I know, there's nothing that can be done, and you can't ask people to hold off discussing for 2 weeks, cause maybe Eastern Europe gets it in 4 weeks, and Australia in 6 or whatever.
I just hate it.
Carry on.
The Vinyamars on Stage! This time at Bag End
- Primula Baggins
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Now you know how some of us feel over here during the new seasons of Doctor Who.
I agree, it's frustrating.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
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Let me throw out a few rambling thoughts after my rewatch of Crossroads 1 and 2, then the season 4 premiere last night. This show never ceases to amaze me in that it has me thinking about it for days after. Lee's 'forgiven' speech at Baltar's trial was brilliant, in that it pulled in so many plot points, even going back to Lee possibly killing a thousand people on the Astral Queen, how many seasons back? So many shows have things happen to serve the plot, never to be seen again. THIS show has these things become a part of the character's life. There is history between these people, as well, that will always become part of their interactions. Lee and Adama's conversation at table's length, with the CAG pin between them, talking about Zack, and the what-ifs of Cylon-ness. Bringing the past and the foreshadowed future together and -oh,my!-what WILL we do about Kara? Despite their history, I believe that Roslin would airlock her in a moment. And because of their history, I don't believe that Adama would.
The other thing that has my mind going into fifty directions at once, is the problems facing the Dylan Four. No time is wasted taking a look at the potential disaster they might be. When Ron Moore talks about the heavy lifting involved in watching this show, this is what he's talking about. When Tigh shot Adama, I believed that it was entirely possible, because it IS! These people may be trying to convince themselves that they're different from Boomer, because they're self-aware, but really, what are they capable of? And what would I do if I were in their place? I think that the show is going to have them be quite different from the other Cylons, but they don't know this. What a scene with that Raider eye to eye with Sam.
I know there's more bouncing around in my head, but I need to rewatch.
The other thing that has my mind going into fifty directions at once, is the problems facing the Dylan Four. No time is wasted taking a look at the potential disaster they might be. When Ron Moore talks about the heavy lifting involved in watching this show, this is what he's talking about. When Tigh shot Adama, I believed that it was entirely possible, because it IS! These people may be trying to convince themselves that they're different from Boomer, because they're self-aware, but really, what are they capable of? And what would I do if I were in their place? I think that the show is going to have them be quite different from the other Cylons, but they don't know this. What a scene with that Raider eye to eye with Sam.
I know there's more bouncing around in my head, but I need to rewatch.
Quick post:
The first 10 minutes of the episode is some of the greatest TV ever. The shots were absolutely amazing and they sure didn't hold back with the CG. It always amazes me how good this TV show looks because, well, it's a TV show. It's not going to have the budget of LotR but the special effects guys really do an astonishing job. Nothing at all looks cheap or cheesy.
I really love that they had the battle happen in the middle of a nebula. The colors were absolutely fantastic.
Btw, I made myself a new header at my LJ. BSG fans should appreciate it!
http://erunameundomiel.livejournal.com/
The first 10 minutes of the episode is some of the greatest TV ever. The shots were absolutely amazing and they sure didn't hold back with the CG. It always amazes me how good this TV show looks because, well, it's a TV show. It's not going to have the budget of LotR but the special effects guys really do an astonishing job. Nothing at all looks cheap or cheesy.
I really love that they had the battle happen in the middle of a nebula. The colors were absolutely fantastic.
Btw, I made myself a new header at my LJ. BSG fans should appreciate it!
http://erunameundomiel.livejournal.com/
- Primula Baggins
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Watched it, though need to watch it again. Champagne and BSG don't mix. It should be viewed while drinking lousy military-grade coffee, I think.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
I watched it. Can't believe they made us wait a year!
Much as I enjoyed it, the overall feeling I took away was "overwrought". I suppose they are trying to hook us into the new season, as well as keep the new viewers on the edge of their seats, but still, the emotions were kept at a fever pitch with no resolution to anything
I find an interesting theme, shown in the conversation between Starbuck and Anders. Where he tells her, if you were a Cylon I would still love you, she says, if you were a Cylon, I would shoot you between the eyes. It's most strongly embodied in the conversation Apollo has with Adama, where he talks about Zak, and what if he came back, but he was a Cylon? Would they feel any differently about him? Would they love him just as much? Apollo's answer seems to be yes.
I am looking forward to the next ep to see some Cylon point of view now that they identified Anders as a final five (by the raider).
Much as I enjoyed it, the overall feeling I took away was "overwrought". I suppose they are trying to hook us into the new season, as well as keep the new viewers on the edge of their seats, but still, the emotions were kept at a fever pitch with no resolution to anything
I find an interesting theme, shown in the conversation between Starbuck and Anders. Where he tells her, if you were a Cylon I would still love you, she says, if you were a Cylon, I would shoot you between the eyes. It's most strongly embodied in the conversation Apollo has with Adama, where he talks about Zak, and what if he came back, but he was a Cylon? Would they feel any differently about him? Would they love him just as much? Apollo's answer seems to be yes.
I am looking forward to the next ep to see some Cylon point of view now that they identified Anders as a final five (by the raider).
The first 10 minutes were really whoa. I was noooo when Tigh fired the shot, glad it wasn't true.
On another site the theory is going around that when the 12 reach earth the 13th tribe is gone, leaving only pieces of their civilzation. And 'Adam' and 'Eve' are a human and a cylon.
And I think the last Cylon is female.
Baltar is the luckiest person around. That's all I have to say about him. He avoids getting killed by pure luck.
I think teh Cylons are messing with Roslin to through her off. Or maybe she is the last Cylon. Anyway the not believing Starbuck is a mistake. And is Starbuck implated with some sort of device that gives her headaches everytime they jump?
I am so buying the DVD's when they come out.
On another site the theory is going around that when the 12 reach earth the 13th tribe is gone, leaving only pieces of their civilzation. And 'Adam' and 'Eve' are a human and a cylon.
And I think the last Cylon is female.
Baltar is the luckiest person around. That's all I have to say about him. He avoids getting killed by pure luck.
I think teh Cylons are messing with Roslin to through her off. Or maybe she is the last Cylon. Anyway the not believing Starbuck is a mistake. And is Starbuck implated with some sort of device that gives her headaches everytime they jump?
I am so buying the DVD's when they come out.
From the ashes, a fire shall be woken. A light from the shadow shall spring. Renewed shall be blade that was broken. The crownless again shall be king.
Loving living in the Pacific Northwest.
Loving living in the Pacific Northwest.
- Primula Baggins
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I have no guess who the last Cylon is, if it isn't Adama or Starbuck, which we've been told it is not.
But, but, but—that third episode!
I love this show. I love this show's writers. They know what has to happen for the story to stay true, no matter how painful it is to see it play out, and they do it.
I was afraid that the baby would die, too; I'm glad they pulled that one punch, because it wasn't necessary (and because it closes out story possibilities, never a good thing—that's the Cruel Writer in me talking).
The cumulative impact of Cally's degeneration, her loss of everything she believed in, finally including her husband's humanity, made the outcome inevitable, though the way it was accomplished, in the end, was a fresh shock.
This season is very strong so far.
But, but, but—that third episode!
I love this show. I love this show's writers. They know what has to happen for the story to stay true, no matter how painful it is to see it play out, and they do it.
I was afraid that the baby would die, too; I'm glad they pulled that one punch, because it wasn't necessary (and because it closes out story possibilities, never a good thing—that's the Cruel Writer in me talking).
The cumulative impact of Cally's degeneration, her loss of everything she believed in, finally including her husband's humanity, made the outcome inevitable, though the way it was accomplished, in the end, was a fresh shock.
This season is very strong so far.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
Amen to that, Prim. This show has some of the best writers in the history of TV
The murder of Cally came as a surprise, and I am now so intrigued to see what will happen with Foster, why she did what she did, now that she looks more in tune with her true cylon nature.
And the look in Anders' face when Kara mentions she feels as if she were watching herself from an alien body... I don't know what to make of it, does he look at her like that because he perfectly understands what she's going through, or because he's just realized she could be a cylon?
Soooooooo many questions!!!!
The murder of Cally came as a surprise, and I am now so intrigued to see what will happen with Foster, why she did what she did, now that she looks more in tune with her true cylon nature.
And the look in Anders' face when Kara mentions she feels as if she were watching herself from an alien body... I don't know what to make of it, does he look at her like that because he perfectly understands what she's going through, or because he's just realized she could be a cylon?
Soooooooo many questions!!!!
Last edited by Breogán on Thu Apr 24, 2008 3:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
Am min idhrinn, min arad en-Naur, bain onen aen: noss, nîth ah estel: adaneth im.
"For one year, one day, of the Flame I would have given all: kin, youth, and hope itself: adaneth I am."
"For one year, one day, of the Flame I would have given all: kin, youth, and hope itself: adaneth I am."
Responding to Breogan's post in the TV obsessions thread:
There have been several times when I wanted to punch Kara in the face, but the urge was the strongest in Unfinished Business when she kept dissing on Lee. Also she was a total bitch to Anders in this last episode. I really wish he'd stop giving into, although that scene was way hot. I just hate seeing him continually used. You can tell he doesn't want to give in to her, that he knows he's being used, but he can't resist her.
Maybe the three of them should just settle down all together. At least stupid Dualla is out of the picture now!
Though in an interview, I think Katee Sackhoff said that Leoben would be Kara's true match....or something like that. Personally I don't see it.
Of course I highly doubt she'll settle down with either one of them. I don't think this will be the type of show that ties everything together neatly with a bow.
There have been several times when I wanted to punch Kara in the face, but the urge was the strongest in Unfinished Business when she kept dissing on Lee. Also she was a total bitch to Anders in this last episode. I really wish he'd stop giving into, although that scene was way hot. I just hate seeing him continually used. You can tell he doesn't want to give in to her, that he knows he's being used, but he can't resist her.
Maybe the three of them should just settle down all together. At least stupid Dualla is out of the picture now!
Though in an interview, I think Katee Sackhoff said that Leoben would be Kara's true match....or something like that. Personally I don't see it.
Of course I highly doubt she'll settle down with either one of them. I don't think this will be the type of show that ties everything together neatly with a bow.
I guess that's what it makes that scene so hot, the fact that he cannot resist the attraction despite knowing she's using himAlso she was a total bitch to Anders in this last episode. I really wish he'd stop giving into, although that scene was way hot. I just hate seeing him continually used. You can tell he doesn't want to give in to her, that he knows he's being used, but he can't resist her.
Indeed, that would be perfect. And if Kara does not agree to it, I will and settle down with Anders and Lee (sometimes one has to make sacrifices for the greater good )Maybe the three of them should just settle down all together. At least stupid Dualla is out of the picture now!
Dualla is one of the most insipid and boring characters... ever. Period.
I remember reading something about Kara and Leoben, and it makes some sense given Kara's deep spirituality, but apart from that, I just can't imagine them together.Though in an interview, I think Katee Sackhoff said that Leoben would be Kara's true match....or something like that. Personally I don't see it.
Of course I highly doubt she'll settle down with either one of them. I don't think this will be the type of show that ties everything together neatly with a bow.
Anyway, you're right, BSG doesn't look like one of those shows where everybody gets a happy ending - and I honestly hope they don't or it will be a great disappointment to finish this fantastic series with "happily ever afters" galore.
Am min idhrinn, min arad en-Naur, bain onen aen: noss, nîth ah estel: adaneth im.
"For one year, one day, of the Flame I would have given all: kin, youth, and hope itself: adaneth I am."
"For one year, one day, of the Flame I would have given all: kin, youth, and hope itself: adaneth I am."
My guess for the final Cylon is Gaeta. That would be sweet justice for him considering the jerk he's been lately. I know it's definitely not Kara even though they are trying to make it look like it is.
Has anyone else been extremely aggravated with Roslin lately? It really hacks me off that she seems to think she has the monopoly on truth and that her thoughts and beliefs are the only correct ones. I mean she has a drug-induced hallucination and expects the entire fleet to follow it and sends Kara off on a mission to retrieve the Arrow. But Kara actually sees Earth, has pictures of it, but no, it must be a cylon trick? Kara must be a cylon? Ugh, I'm so tired of her condescension toward Commander Adama because he believes in Kara. I wish he would say "Frak you" and do his own thing.
I really don't like the preview flashes BSG does at the very beginning of the show. For this last episode, they totally showed a shot of Tory punching Cally and someone pushing the airlock button. It was not at all a surprise that it happened. I really wish they would not have shown that, especially after reading the latest entry at Bear McCreary's blog (here's the snipet from it and I highly recommend reading his blog! http://www.bearmccreary.com/blog/ ):
A lot of us rejoiced when Cally was airlocked! She was an annoying character and personally I don't like the actress. Someone even went so far as to make this icon:
After rewatching the episode, I actually feel sorry for Cally now. A lot of people were wondering if her going crazy had something to do with the nebula, or if the nebula affected her son and he was being more cranky which made her more tired...but I think it was mostly her husband not being around. I think she was tired from raising their child on her own, she didn't feel supported and loved, then on top of that suspecting an affair...that's enough to really affect someone. Add finding out your husband is a cylon, it isn't surprising she lost it.
Tory's callousness did surprise me. She seems to be really understanding what it means to be a cylon. She seems to be realizing her power. It's going to be interesting to see what she starts to do and how Tigh will react.
I also wonder how they don't know that Cally was murdered? Surely they can tell the airlock was not activated from the inside?
Has anyone else been extremely aggravated with Roslin lately? It really hacks me off that she seems to think she has the monopoly on truth and that her thoughts and beliefs are the only correct ones. I mean she has a drug-induced hallucination and expects the entire fleet to follow it and sends Kara off on a mission to retrieve the Arrow. But Kara actually sees Earth, has pictures of it, but no, it must be a cylon trick? Kara must be a cylon? Ugh, I'm so tired of her condescension toward Commander Adama because he believes in Kara. I wish he would say "Frak you" and do his own thing.
I really don't like the preview flashes BSG does at the very beginning of the show. For this last episode, they totally showed a shot of Tory punching Cally and someone pushing the airlock button. It was not at all a surprise that it happened. I really wish they would not have shown that, especially after reading the latest entry at Bear McCreary's blog (here's the snipet from it and I highly recommend reading his blog! http://www.bearmccreary.com/blog/ ):
Honestly, his music did almost trick me. I almost could believe it was all going to be okay, but I still knew about that moment that Tory strikes Cally. Shame the preview ruined it.As Tory explains herself to Cally, the yialli tanbur, duduk and zhong hu play statements of the Final Four theme (which I explained in detail in my He That Believeth… entry). In these first few episodes of Season Four, we have witnessed each of the Final Four react to the knowledge of their Cylon natures differently, yet this melodic theme has represented them all. Here it underscores Tory reaching out to Cally, though the orchestration still suggests that there’s something unsettling about the whole situation.
This conversation was a delicate tight-rope walk for me, since I wanted to keep up the tension, but I also wanted to mislead the audience into believing that Tory might be genuinely trying to save Cally from making a terrible mistake. And, naturally, I forgot to consider the hysterically screaming baby in the scene that renders this cue virtually inaudible anyway… this is what soundtrack albums are for I guess.
Regardless, the moment leading up to Tory striking Cally is an excellent example of musical misdirection.
Cally falls to her knees, and Tory comforts her. I scored this touching scene as if the episode were about to fade to black on a warm, resolved ending. A solo duduk enters, playing a lush arrangement of the original Cally / Tyrol love theme.
This familiar tune, tracing all the way back to Season 1, washes away the sour, dissonant and melancholy Cally Theme that has reverberated throughout the entire episode. And for a fleeting moment, it appears as if all is well. Of course, we soon discover Tory is up to no good…
I personally felt that the opening title drum montage betrayed this wonderful moment, since we clearly saw Tory smacking Cally. So, you guys will have to let me know if this fleeting moment of compassion actually tricked you or not, but I hope it did. For me, the sudden shift in tone when Tory knocks Cally back is one of the most vicious and brutal moments in the entire series and I’m thrilled that the score could play such an effective and sneaky role.
A lot of us rejoiced when Cally was airlocked! She was an annoying character and personally I don't like the actress. Someone even went so far as to make this icon:
After rewatching the episode, I actually feel sorry for Cally now. A lot of people were wondering if her going crazy had something to do with the nebula, or if the nebula affected her son and he was being more cranky which made her more tired...but I think it was mostly her husband not being around. I think she was tired from raising their child on her own, she didn't feel supported and loved, then on top of that suspecting an affair...that's enough to really affect someone. Add finding out your husband is a cylon, it isn't surprising she lost it.
Tory's callousness did surprise me. She seems to be really understanding what it means to be a cylon. She seems to be realizing her power. It's going to be interesting to see what she starts to do and how Tigh will react.
I also wonder how they don't know that Cally was murdered? Surely they can tell the airlock was not activated from the inside?
And the fact that he totally uses her to get some of his frustrations out. I wish they hadn't cut away when they did!Breogán wrote:I guess that's what it makes that scene so hot, the fact that he cannot resist the attraction despite knowing she's using him
Agreed. Her only point seems to be a distraction for Lee. Maybe she'll die soon too.Dualla is one of the most insipid and boring characters... ever. Period.
I won't be satisfied either way. I don't like cheesy, predictable endings, but I also don't like open or sad endings. I'm tough to please.Anyway, you're right, BSG doesn't look like one of those shows where everybody gets a happy ending - and I honestly hope they don't or it will be a great disappointment to finish this fantastic series with "happily ever afters" galore.
- Primula Baggins
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Shortly after I started watching the show, I started looking away from the screen during the preview bits. This is such a surprising, intelligent show, I want to see it as I'm meant to.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
I close my eyes during the preview
I demand an Uncut version of Galactica NOW!!!And the fact that he totally uses her to get some of his frustrations out. I wish they hadn't cut away when they did!
Last edited by Breogán on Thu Apr 24, 2008 1:47 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Am min idhrinn, min arad en-Naur, bain onen aen: noss, nîth ah estel: adaneth im.
"For one year, one day, of the Flame I would have given all: kin, youth, and hope itself: adaneth I am."
"For one year, one day, of the Flame I would have given all: kin, youth, and hope itself: adaneth I am."