God's Debris

[Alatar]

A friend of mine just forwarded this to me. It might be an interesting group read, particularly for the members in here.

http://www.andrewsmcmeel.com/godsdebris/

Synopsis

Imagine that you meet a very old man who—you eventually realize—knows literally everything. Imagine that he explains for you the great mysteries of life—quantum physics, evolution, God, gravity, light, psychic phenomenon, and probability—in a way so simple, so novel, and so compelling that it all fits together and makes perfect sense. What does it feel like to suddenly understand everything? God's Debris isn’t the final answer to the Big Questions. But it might be the most compelling vision of reality you will ever read. The thought experiment is this: Try to figure out what’s wrong with the old man’s explanation of reality. Share the book with your smart friends then discuss it later while enjoying a beverage.

[Impenitent]

Have you read it Alatar? Have you found it as compelling as that blurb?

I am intrigued by it - I wonder how the author came up with simple but compelling explanations of life, the universe and everything!

[Alatar]

I haven't read it yet. I thought we might do so together?

[Jnyusa]

This looks cool, Alatar. I'm going to download it and give it a shot.

Are you willing to lead the discussion? (she asked, shamefully, after abandoning the Irish mythology thread)

Jn

[MaidenOfTheShieldarm]

That sounds fascinating. I downloaded it as well. I have proved to myself time and again that I cannot keep up with group chapter-by-chapter reads, but I'd certainly be interesting in discussing after reading the whole thing.

[Primula Baggins]

Written by the author of "Dilbert"?

Well, Mr. Prim thinks he's a god. . . .

(Seriously, this looks very interesting, but I don't think I have time to participate. I may download the book and look through it, though.)

[narya]

The first thirty pages were interesting. It is a very quick read, and I'd finish it tonight, but it is late. Maybe tomorrow.

[Angbasdil]

I read it about a month ago. It's mostly brilliant, but occasionally lapses into mere genius.

I was seriously considering starting a discussion of it somewhere (there's just so many boards to choose from anymore ), but was going to wait until I had more time. Offline life has me pretty busy here lately.

But I'll keep an eye on this thread and hop ino the discussion once y'all have had time to read it.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

I'd be interested in participating (as long as I don't have to lead the discussion).

[yovargas]

I finally got around to printing this. Can't type much so won't be able to comment a great deal, but I'll try and read it this week and give some reaction.

[Alatar]

Well, I finally got round to reading this. It's quite short and very clever.

Before I start discussing I'd like to know if people have read it. I don't want to pre-empt anything.

[yovargas]

I did. Some was really fun, some was pretty lame. Cool overall. IMO.

[Alatar]

It will be interesting to see if we thought the same things were lame and the same things were cool!

[Jnyusa]

Read it today.

How many have we got for discussion? I'm really eager to hear the reactions of those who read it!

Jn

[Alatar]

That's 4 I think...

Jnyusa, Yova, Ang and Myself

[yovargas]

Can't type much so won't be able to comment a great deal...

Bad arms and all.

[Jnyusa]

I think narya has read most of it, too.

Maybe we should start registering impressions? When we first started discussing Strange and Norrell only a few people had read it, but the discussion prompted others to read it.

Just fyi, it took me about 1.5 hours to read this. Others' mileage may vary, but it's not lengthy ... about 50% shorter than a Nancy Drew Mystery.


Jn

[Faramond]

I read this.

I think it should first be taken as it's presented, as a work of fiction. I don't much feel like pretending it's really a philosophical tract, even though it seems so much like one. It has a plot, of a kind. It has characters: the dim-witted easily-led delivery boy, the wily old man who makes it seem like he knows everything, and ... that's all.

It is hard to talk about it without treating it as a philosophical tract. Yet even as we do that I think it's always important to keep in mind that this is a story. In a story if you change the characters things turn out differently, and so it is here. If the delivery boy was less credulous and more able to see all the holes in the old man's arguments then things might have turned out differently, and the conversation that is the centerpiece of the story would be more like a real conversation and less like Plato pontificating.

There are some passages that are creative and brilliant, and there are some sections that I thought were rather poor. The central premise, the reason for the title of the story, I find absurd. But there is a lot of interesting stuff to talk about here. I don't think there's much value in "debunking" or arguing with some of the old man's ideas ... rather they can serve as launching points for discussions. That's the value of remembering that this is a story, even if an unusual one.

[Jnyusa]

Faramond: The central premise, the reason for the title of the story, I find absurd.

It's a cost-free theory. If true, nothing changes; if false, nothing changes.

And, it's actually a rather old idea that the Universe is god's attempt to discover him/herself.

Faramond, did you find the mathematical approach to be out of date?

Jn

[Angbasdil]

Faramond,

I think we should take our cue on how to approach this book from the author's introduction. I also think you're right in saying that this book shouldn't be approached as a philosophical treatise - Adams makes it clear that these are not his own opinions and beliefs he's presenting. They're merely some interesting ideas intended to spur discussion. But I don't see much value in approaching this as a story either because, let's face it, there's just not much story there. The story is mostly just a vehicle for conveying the aforementioned ideas, and it serves that purpose well enough, I suppose. But that's not really what the book is about.

As for 'debunking' Mr. Avatar's ideas, I think that is exactly what Adams had in mind for us to do.

Try to figure out what's wrong with the simplest explanations.

That sounds like a fine way to begin the discussion, anyway.
We'll see where it goes from there.